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01:54:08  <devsnek>is `import * as X, { Y, Z } from '...'` valid?
01:55:50  <devsnek>babel keeps trying to output something like that
02:08:56  <ljharb>devsnek: i think it probably could be, but i think it's not? not 100% sure
02:09:08  <devsnek>ljharb: i'm also very confused lol
02:21:49  <devsnek>https://tc39.github.io/ecma262/#sec-typeof-operator-runtime-semantics-evaluation
02:21:55  <devsnek>won't Type(val) always be Completion
02:23:17  <devsnek>i think this needs an extra ReturnIfAbrupt(val)
02:24:48  <ljharb>devsnek: GetValue will throw if `[[Get]]` returns abruptly
02:25:04  <ljharb>devsnek: like what about a getter on the global object that throws
02:25:11  <devsnek>yeah but there's no GetValue before the Type(val)
02:25:15  <devsnek>step 2
02:25:21  <ljharb>i'm confused
02:25:31  <ljharb>there's no ReturnIfAbryupt
02:25:33  <devsnek>where it says if Type(val) is Reference
02:25:39  <ljharb>sure
02:25:42  <devsnek>at that point, won't val always be a completion
02:26:06  <devsnek>which might have [[Value]]: some reference
02:26:15  <devsnek>so Type(val) would be Completion
02:27:06  <ljharb>would "evaluating UnaryExpression" return a completion?
02:27:25  <devsnek>what else would it do
02:27:40  <devsnek>don't all productions implicitly return completions
02:28:00  <ljharb>i'm not sure that's the case, due to reference
02:28:01  <ljharb>s
02:28:29  <ljharb>https://tc39.github.io/ecma262/#sec-delete-operator-runtime-semantics-evaluation for example evals a unary expr and then does returnifabrupt, and then checks to see if it's a reference
02:28:33  <devsnek>wouldn't it be `[[Value]]: a reference` in that case?
02:28:53  <ljharb>i don't think [[Value]] can contain a reference
02:28:57  <ljharb>i think that can only be a JS value
02:29:22  <ljharb>(because a reference isn't a reified thing, just like a completion record is not)
02:33:46  <jmdyck>(In my world, where Normal Completions do not exist, evaluation returns a language value or ~empty~ or a Reference or an abrupt completion (I think).)
02:37:17  <jmdyck>In status quo spec world, it's a bit messy.
02:38:40  <jmdyck>Type(_val_) isn't *necessarily* always Completion, because "Any reference to a Completion Record value that is in a context that does not explicitly require a complete Completion Record value is equivalent to an explicit reference to the [[Value]] field of the Completion Record value ..."
02:39:26  <jmdyck>and Type(...) isn't a context that explicitly requires a "complete Completion Record value",
02:39:43  <devsnek>whatever the case is in reality
02:39:51  <devsnek>the spec has a disparity somewhere
02:39:58  <jmdyck>yup
02:40:52  <devsnek>normal completions not existing sounds fine until things like Call check for [[Type]]
02:40:54  <jmdyck>see https://github.com/tc39/ecma262/issues/496
02:42:00  <devsnek>i'm not quite sure what to do here though
02:42:42  <devsnek>domenic says everything should be completions and i kinda agree
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02:43:34  <jmdyck>where code currently checks [[Type]], it would, in my world, (first) ask "is this an abrupt completion?" (or perhaps "is this a normal value?")
02:45:03  <devsnek>i don't see any reason why spec types can't be in completions
02:45:13  <devsnek>and it would solve this problem
02:45:42  <jmdyck>yeah, well, I disagree with the "everything should be completions" camp, but I'm not pushing on it for now
02:45:59  <devsnek>well something needs to happen
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02:49:28  <jmdyck>people seem to be able to create interoperable implementations despite the spec's inconsistency on this point, so it's somewhat debatable whether something *needs* to happen
02:49:42  <devsnek>sigh
02:51:57  <jmdyck>indeed, sigh.
02:52:50  <devsnek>modified completion coercion to ignore references
02:53:15  <devsnek>i hope no one ever benchmarks this engine
02:57:13  <jmdyck>going back a ways, Type(_val_) isn't necessarily Completion, but if you apply it to an Abrupt Completion, the result is probably Completion. So I don't think you need a ReturnIfAbrupt() on that score.
03:46:15  <jmdyck>Although inserting one would probably be clearer.
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15:43:47  <reefath>hello
15:45:08  <leobalter>hi
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23:32:10  <devsnek>why does Symbol.species even exist
23:32:46  <devsnek>its like instead of individual methods deciding if it makes sense to return an instance of the original class or subclass, it overrides everything
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