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00:05:22  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 50.57.72.69(free7)
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00:10:22  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 166.78.104.64(dev-ie10-2)
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00:15:07  <substack>ogd: how do sidechannel transfer protocol encoded strings work?
00:15:09  <substack>chrisdickinson: ^^
00:18:05  <rvagg>isaacs: ping, you here?
00:18:06  <chrisdickinson>it's been a while, but: it takes the stream and multiplexes it by prepending chunks from each individual stream with a 4 byte pkt-line style length + 1 byte stream code, followed by the data for that stream
00:18:44  <chrisdickinson>(where the stream code is 1 for data, 2 for progress, and 3 for fatal errors)
00:18:58  <defunctzombie>does github not escate <script> tags in issue comments?
00:19:16  <defunctzombie>if I write <script> in an issue comment everything after dissapears
00:19:20  <substack>chrisdickinson: is there a module that just does that?
00:19:49  <chrisdickinson>https://github.com/chrisdickinson/git-write-pkt-line will do the size
00:19:54  <chrisdickinson>but not the stream code
00:20:21  <substack>cool
00:21:00  <chrisdickinson>(https://github.com/chrisdickinson/git-read-pkt-line is the opposite side of that, with https://github.com/chrisdickinson/git-transport-protocol/ wrapping both)
00:21:23  <defunctzombie>oh I see, they just remove it entirely
00:21:46  <substack>chrisdickinson: this is the patch that implements it inside of pushover I got a while back https://github.com/substack/pushover/pull/10.patch
00:21:57  <substack>going to use that as a reference for this module
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00:22:22  <Raynos>o/
00:22:37  <Raynos>does anyone have a module that creates folder / files for your tests easily? ( https://gist.github.com/Raynos/8327284 )
00:22:45  <Raynos>I'd rather not implement it myself :D
00:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 20]
00:24:40  <isaacs>rvagg: hola
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00:25:22  <ogd>substack: https://gist.github.com/maxogden/8327311
00:25:56  <ogd>substack: (taken from pull req #10)
00:26:16  <substack>ogd: publish it to npm?
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00:26:48  <ogd>substack: ok
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00:30:04  <marcello3d>anyone get crap like this on os x when running npm test: sh: ./node_modules/.bin/mocha: /usr/bin/env: bad interpreter: Operation not permitted
00:31:29  <marcello3d>it's fine if I prefix with node
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00:37:35  <ogd>substack: ok https://github.com/maxogden/git-side-band-message
00:38:02  <chrisdickinson>ogd: one thing to look out for is that you can't encode flush packets that way (they have to be just '0000')
00:38:03  <grncdr>marcello3d: no, I don't ever get that...
00:38:05  <chrisdickinson>also all data coming through the stream at that point has to be framed
00:38:11  <chrisdickinson>so it can't be just `\2`
00:38:12  <ogd>chrisdickinson: yea
00:38:22  <substack>ogd: sweet!
00:38:29  <chrisdickinson>ogd: tangentially, was thinking about build a workshopper where you'd build your own dvcs (based on git principles)
00:38:37  <ogd>chrisdickinson: hah awesome idea
00:41:25  <grncdr>chrisdickinson: I would do that
00:41:25  <chrisdickinson>ogd: re: https://github.com/maxogden/git-side-band-message/blob/master/index.js#L5 -- most clients support sideband-64k now
00:42:08  <ogd>chrisdickinson: oh good to know
00:45:04  <grncdr>Raynos: this may/may not be interesting to you: https://gist.github.com/grncdr/612586b5d808ba826ea4
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00:46:42  <grncdr>was thinking about it yesterday but wasn't awake enough to write it down at the time
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00:59:51  <rvagg>isaacs: I'm fiddling with getting the streams tests from .11 working with 0.10 and 0.8
01:00:13  <rvagg>isaacs: one bit that has me stumped is the test in test-stream2-stderr-sync.js
01:00:43  <rvagg>isaacs: it uses 'tty_wrap' to make a tty and .write() to it for child0, all the other children pass using console.log/error process.stdout, etc., but this tty one doesn't
01:00:59  <rvagg>isaacs: anything off the top of your head that might be different enough in 0.11 with tty_wrap that might cause this?
01:01:47  <rvagg>isaacs: it's throwing a 'write' error on handle.writeUtf8String()
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01:02:39  <rvagg>isaacs: I could simply make this child do a console.log for node 0.10 and 0.8 but I'm not sure what the error is here so perhaps that's masking a problem
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01:08:16  <rvagg>isaacs: ahh.. perhaps this is the problem -- StreamWrap::WriteStringImpl() seems to return a handle to the object in 0.10 but an error object in 0.11
01:09:15  <rvagg>isaacs: it does a SetErrno(err) in case of an error, so I should check for a return === null in 0.10 and fetch the errno from somewhere (where?)
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01:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 34]
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01:25:32  <Raynos>grncdr: how deep were you in the gulp flame last night? :D
01:25:57  <grncdr>I dropped out around 1am I think, I had a phone meeting this morning
01:26:03  <grncdr>it was silly
01:26:29  <grncdr>I tried to lighten the mood a couple times but nobody likes my dumb jokes ;)
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01:27:19  <grncdr>I remember phated asking "how would you do this" and I was thinking "this is how" but I couldn't be bothered to write that code at the time :)
01:27:41  <grncdr>oh weird, he quit immediately before I said that...
01:27:48  <grncdr>:\
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01:28:55  <grncdr>anyways I don't want to provoke more argument, as I don't really care, but I was curious whether you thought that little sketch would be useful enough to publish
01:29:26  <grncdr>I'm going to try using it on a new project right away here, so I'll find out for myself soon enough ;)
01:31:42  <grncdr>also, anybody know if there's a good site comparing the various sync-data-to-all-clients-and-the-db things out there?
01:32:05  <grncdr>like the todomvc of apps that sync distributed state in real time?
01:32:57  <grncdr>doesn't need to be a central db either I guess. I should look into level-sync or whatever it is
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01:35:28  <marcello3d>haven't seen such, I feel like there aren't that many...
01:36:12  <rvagg>isaacs: anyway, https://github.com/isaacs/readable-stream/pull/73 works with Node 0.10 now, not 0.8 but that's likely to be existing stuff so I'm not going to spend my whole day on that (yet)
01:36:43  <grncdr>hm, anybody using level-replicate in "real" apps? is it good enough to "just work" ?
01:36:45  <rvagg>isaacs: I've faked out the TTY test for node !0.11, too hard
01:36:50  <marcello3d>there's the derby/racer/sharejs thing, meteorjs, thj's mydb thing?
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01:41:02  <grncdr>gah, why do all of them only use mongo :|
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01:47:36  <ogd>grncdr: i think the dropbox datastore api is interesting and worth reading about
01:47:40  <ogd>grncdr: its basically couchdb but simpler
01:48:06  <ogd>grncdr: last time i used level-replicate it didnt work with more than 2 peers
01:48:22  <grncdr>ogd: I believe it, but this for "enterprise" apps so offsite data is a no-go :\
01:48:55  <grncdr>honestly racer looks like mostly what I want
01:49:36  <Raynos>you can also use sharejs directly
01:49:48  <grncdr>I'm really not a fan of mongo though… might have to take a closer look at what it would take to allay my fears about it
01:50:25  <marcello3d>man. free tmobile plan on caltrain is unreliable :D
01:50:40  <grncdr>Raynos: that's a good point about ShareJS, I was just reading about livedb
01:50:53  <grncdr>which might even be enough for my needs
01:51:17  <marcello3d>mongo is meh in my experience. best to avoid if you can
01:51:31  <grncdr>but honestly I think my use-case is going to be close enough to the usual conventions that I might benefit from just adopting the framework
01:51:58  <grncdr>not all of derby, but from racer down looks ok
01:52:10  <marcello3d>yea, derby is a bit monolithic
01:52:17  <Raynos>grncdr: I've implemented like 5 versions of this idea
01:52:20  <Raynos>they were all a bit ghetto
01:52:26  <marcello3d>I like 80% of their ideas, but it's hard to change the 20%
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01:53:14  <grncdr>Raynos: yeah I've done similar things myself, I'm looking at something more off the shelf though because I will need to hand this off to somebody else
01:53:25  <Raynos>oh :p
01:53:27  <marcello3d>is there any irc proxy service that is robust to connection loss? kind of hard to follow a conversation when it drops out randomly
01:53:30  <Raynos>use crdt or scuttlebutt :D
01:53:43  <grncdr>haha
01:53:46  <grncdr>like it's tempting
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01:54:13  <grncdr>but I don't think it's the right choice in this case...
01:54:17  <Raynos>:D
01:54:17  <grncdr>who knows I could be wrong
01:55:09  <grncdr>maybe rolling a new distributed database is really what my clients want, and they just don't know it yet ;)
01:55:20  <grncdr>GOATDB
01:56:12  <substack>pushover is really big >_<
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01:56:38  <grncdr>hm, so it's 400 lines of code to implement a the mongo adapter for livedb… might be possible to just write that bit myself...
01:56:42  <grncdr>substack: how big?
01:57:01  <ogd>substack: big as in big in china or big as in socket.io
01:57:17  <ogd>or i guess its more commonly 'big in japan'
01:57:27  <Raynos>grncdr: you might want to just use couch & pouch
01:57:47  <grncdr>Raynos: I've been leaning that way
01:57:57  <grncdr>I trust couch *way* more than mongo
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01:58:47  <grncdr>and hooking up a _changes listener and feeding it relevant changes to connected clients seems pretty simple...
01:59:01  <grncdr>I haven't looked at pouch that closely before though
01:59:12  <grncdr>is the syncing stuff pretty baked in?
01:59:15  <substack>ogd: big as in too much cleverness
01:59:22  <substack>and I don't know what the code is doing
01:59:45  <grncdr>oh lol, first thing on pouchdb.com "The Database that Syncs!"
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02:00:32  <marcello3d>sync or swim?
02:01:04  * grncdr:|
02:01:05  <LOUDBOT>APEIRON GO AND TELL EVERYONE HOW THE CHURCH OF HAILO HAS CHANGED YOUR LIFE FOR THE BETTER
02:01:31  <marcello3d>o_O
02:02:20  <grncdr>Raynos: being that you've been through this process a few times, what would you say the cons are to using pouch/couch
02:02:59  <grncdr>ogd: ^^
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02:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 4, free: 18]
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02:32:22  <Raynos>grncdr: no experience with pouch/couch
02:32:30  <Raynos>lots of eperience with mongo === gtfo mongo
02:33:46  <AvianFlu>mongo is a horrible thing
02:33:51  <mikolalysenko>yeah
02:33:52  <AvianFlu>a true danger to its users
02:34:15  <mikolalysenko>having used it as well, I would also consider it to be something of a mistake
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02:34:27  <AvianFlu>the worst part about it is how easy it is to get started
02:34:35  <AvianFlu>you get lured into impossible positions
02:34:40  <mikolalysenko>yep
02:34:50  <AvianFlu>from which mongo inc. hopes to get you to pay thousands of dollars for support contracts
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02:37:14  <mikolalysenko>for getting started it is probably easier to start with json.stringify/parse
02:37:33  <mikolalysenko>or no persistent state at all
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02:38:19  <substack>couch is ok
02:38:22  <AvianFlu>yeah but like, if you're sitting down and you say "how do I use mongo?"
02:38:30  <AvianFlu>it's really easy to get simple things working
02:38:53  <substack>but level is really my kind of database
02:39:08  <AvianFlu>then, you start to get a little traffic, and you start finding places where there's a difference of 1000x in performance between doing it right and doing it wrong
02:39:31  <AvianFlu>and it's often counterintuitive, where it breaks down
02:39:36  <AvianFlu>cause it's shit they just didn't build yet
02:39:54  <mikolalysenko>level is pretty good as a level of abstraction directly above fs
02:40:09  <AvianFlu>couch is great, but you need to be putting documents you want revision history for into it
02:40:14  <AvianFlu>if you're not doing that it gets real ugly
02:40:15  <mikolalysenko>couch is good at creating higher level things with replication and more
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02:48:24  <rvagg>yay! readable-stream 1.1 (streams3/0.11) and 1.0 (streams2/0.10) are in sync with node releases again
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03:09:31  <indexzero>AvianFlu: CouchDB. The solution to and cause of all of your data problems
03:10:51  <indexzero>that came off less jovial than I meant it
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03:11:42  <substack>ogd: git actually has a kind of sweet rsync-style transactiony thing inside of it
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03:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 14]
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03:36:25  <rowbit1>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) beck@... successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
03:36:25  <rowbit1>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
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03:57:48  <py1hon_>substack: bcachefs untars the linux kernel faster than ext4 :D
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04:12:02  <substack>py1hon: rad
04:12:35  <py1hon>substack: you feeling any better?
04:12:45  <py1hon>hoping to bug you about git stuff at some point
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04:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 3, free: 34]
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04:33:16  <substack>py1hon: a bit better
04:33:25  <substack>py1hon: cool I'm hacking on a git thing right now
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04:56:04  <airportyh>substack: ping
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05:02:10  <substack>airportyh: yo
05:03:07  <airportyh>substack: wanted to talk to you about ATL. Apparently you've been under the weather?
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05:06:37  <substack>airportyh: ok I'm not sure what the plan is
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05:09:25  <airportyh>substack: our next date jan 20th, but it's flexible. if you need more time to recover or anything, we could either change the date, or do it in feb instead.
05:09:58  <substack>airportyh: maybe feb would be better
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05:11:01  <airportyh>substack: ok, feb 17 alright?
05:12:40  <isaacs_>rvagg: It's perfectly acceptable to say that readable-stream only can get you 1 branch up
05:12:56  <isaacs_>rvagg: ie, 1.1/1.2 require node >=0.10
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05:15:42  <rvagg>isaacs_: yeah ... but then anything using it has to totally rule out 0.8 support which a lot of projects aren't willing to do
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05:16:00  <isaacs_>rvagg: well, they can pin to 1.0
05:16:32  <rvagg>isaacs_: yeah, that's fine but we need to educate! I'll do up a new README when I have a chance
05:17:08  <isaacs_>rvagg: replace the readme with that blog post )
05:17:09  <isaacs_>:)
05:17:24  <rvagg>I guess going forward if we have this testing stuff sorted out for new code filtering back in to readable-stream we can catch issues with older versions and maintain better backwards compat
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05:19:54  <rvagg>need to polish that post and get it published, will try and do that this arvo
05:22:30  <substack>airportyh: sounds good
05:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 2, free: 13]
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05:23:41  <contrahax>have you guys seen the brandon wirtz video about node?
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05:26:32  <airportyh>substack: sweet! Could you take some time to settle on the flight and hotel perhaps within a week's time? It'll help my planning to firm up the date. We'll cover the costs.
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05:30:26  <substack>airportyh: ok, can do
05:30:36  <airportyh>substack: thanks!
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05:33:29  <airportyh>substack: Something unrelated: I've been working on a way to make components work with npm+browserify
05:33:38  <airportyh>substack: here's a first attempt https://github.com/npmcomponent
05:34:28  <airportyh>substack: these are clones of the component repos but modified so that all the dependencies with npm+browserify
05:35:58  <substack>somebody made this https://npmjs.org/package/decomponentify
05:36:09  <substack>not sure how applicable it is to how you're approaching it though
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05:37:00  <airportyh>substack: yeah, I researched that before. I think this is better :)
05:37:16  <airportyh>substack: you can use npm and browserify directly
05:37:48  <airportyh>substack: ex: to install the component component/dialog, you'd do `npm install npmcomponent/component-dialog`
05:38:10  <airportyh>substack: you require('component-dialog'), and everything just works
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05:40:17  <airportyh>substack: easier than decomponentify in that doesn't require you to use component. anyway, thought it would be interesting to browserify users.
05:40:18  <substack>airportyh: but won't you need to publish everything to npm?
05:40:23  <substack>and keep the versions in sync?
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05:40:58  <airportyh>substack: first phase, I'd just use github for hosting. and yes, I need to run a crobjob somewhere to keep them in sync
05:41:15  <airportyh>substack: next phase, yeah I plan to publish to npm at some point
05:41:47  <airportyh>substack: so yes, it will take some processing power
05:42:47  <substack>cool
05:43:05  <substack>a lot of components are cross-published to npm already too
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05:43:44  <airportyh>yeah, currently I mirror them anyway
05:43:49  <airportyh>just so it's easier to implement
05:44:27  <airportyh>I need to decide whether or not to detect if it's in npm already and point to the existing packages vs mirroring
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05:57:44  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: i started to use bips and currently don't have time to switch until next month, but would like to help you and use the product.
05:59:08  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: i would contact you in february, i am quite busy atm :(
05:59:25  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: are you at fosdem?
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06:05:23  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 50.57.72.69(free7)
06:10:23  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 166.78.104.64(dev-ie10-2)
06:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 27]
06:24:42  <ogd>i found juliangruber's band on youtube! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZviYmTMpBXE
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07:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 23]
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07:50:56  <contrahax>javascript is sloowwwww https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enyx4szIVV8
08:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 29]
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08:49:23  <mmalecki>robertkowalski: sure thing! I'll email you and let's set up a Skype call so that I can better understand what you need :)
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09:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 21]
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09:38:22  <ehd>rvagg: hah, i just saw you removed the `const` from bl two days ago. i had someone complain about a package that comes bundled with bl not working in IE also two days ago :) now let's see if a new version works
09:38:51  <rvagg>ehd: work in progress getting browser tests to pass
09:39:04  <rvagg>ehd: not sure if I've even published the non-const version .. let me know if I need to
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09:40:03  <ehd>bl on npm is at 0.6.0, please publish the non-const version :)
09:40:18  <trodrigues>hah. I was wondering why we had gotten that tweet (it was a tweet right?)
09:41:16  <rvagg>ehd: @0.7.0 published, I even replaced an Object.keys() with a for-in.
09:41:16  <ehd>not sure, i had a github issue and support requests
09:41:24  <ehd>rvagg: excellent, thank you!
09:42:17  <rvagg>I was working on browser testing bl cause it's a devDep of through2 and I wanted browser tests for that...
09:42:19  <rvagg>yak shaving
09:43:00  <trodrigues>yeah, that was it, gh issue
09:43:13  <ehd>a yak worth shaving
09:43:32  <trodrigues>what about just telling people to use an es5-shim? not acceptable?
09:43:42  <trodrigues>as in, users of bl, not things depending on it
09:44:32  <rvagg>yeah, I dunno... I didn't imagine people would use bl in the browser but then it got string support and then browserify got better buffer support
09:45:27  <trodrigues>heh
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10:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 36]
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11:23:10  <rowbit1>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 53]
11:28:39  <timoxley>rvagg: if `const` breaks IE, basically none of your packages will work in IE
11:29:09  <rvagg>timoxley: yeah well I tend to have an idea in my head of which packages could be used in the browser and which not
11:29:10  <timoxley>trodrigues: I don't know if a shim can fix const?
11:29:14  <rvagg>mostly I'm not writing stuff for the browser
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11:29:33  <timoxley>rvagg: "yeah, I dunno... I didn't imagine people would use bl in the browser but then…"
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11:29:41  <rvagg>there's a browserify transform that'll change const to var, just use that
11:29:47  <timoxley>voila
11:30:11  <rvagg>shaddup! I like my const, it makes me feel special
11:30:50  <rvagg>browsers suck, who would develop for browsers??
11:31:41  <timoxley>masochists mostly
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11:46:07  <rowbit1>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) andreas@... successfully signed up for developer browserling plan ($20). Cash money! /!\
11:46:07  <rowbit1>/!\ ATTENTION: (default-local) paid account successfully upgraded /!\
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11:59:50  <trodrigues>timoxley: yeah true. derp.
12:00:16  <trodrigues>hey I develop mostly for browsers!
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12:05:24  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 50.57.72.69(free7)
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12:10:24  <rowbit1>substack, pkrumins: These encoders are STILL down: 166.78.104.64(dev-ie10-2)
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12:40:41  <nfroidure>Are streams synchronous until you pipe in content asynchronously or read their contents asynchronously ?
12:41:17  <nfroidure>I have this feeling but not sure
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14:12:25  <jesusabdullah>brianloveswords: are these falafel trucks any good? I need a food and everything else here's all, "I hope you like sitting down!"
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14:13:02  <brianloveswords>jesusabdullah: haha which ones where? I mean they're all pretty much the same, they'll get the job done.
14:13:31  <jesusabdullah>brianloveswords: yeah I just assumed they were ubiquitous. These are on 44th and 6th ave
14:13:52  <jesusabdullah>What I *really* want is a breakfast sammy
14:14:12  <brianloveswords>I'm very rarely up that far in Manhattan, but yeah, they're all the same. I'm sure you can find a truck to make you and egg sandwich or something, though.
14:14:16  <jesusabdullah>nooo idea what to goog for though and I don't feel like wandering the streets
14:14:48  <jesusabdullah>coffee place only had donuts n' shit
14:15:01  <brianloveswords>jesusabdullah: http://www.yelp.com/search?find_desc=&find_loc=44th+and+6th&ns=1&ls=84f7191a5d50e487#find_desc=breakfast+sandwich
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14:15:24  <brianloveswords>jesusabdullah: bodegas and bagel places are your best bet.
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14:16:43  <jesusabdullah>yecch
14:17:28  <jesusabdullah>Yeah maybe I should just hit up the nearest bodega
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14:18:54  <jjjohnny>jesusabdullah: scrape the edible layer off the sidewalk
14:19:04  <jesusabdullah>oh okay
14:20:34  <jjjohnny>jesusabdullah: where you staying?
14:20:44  <jjjohnny>manhattan hotel?
14:20:52  <jesusabdullah>jjjohnny: Yeah, basically Thymes Square
14:21:09  <jesusabdullah>jjjohnny: "I think Las Vegas exploded all over your intersection guys you should probably mop that up"
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14:21:27  <jjjohnny>jesusabdullah: can you haz room service?
14:21:42  <jjjohnny>:D
14:21:58  <jesusabdullah>Oh, and good mawnin' america is apparently filmed right around the corner, they were doin' one of those segments where they have a counter and it probably involves food but maybe consumer products
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14:22:02  <jesusabdullah>you know the ones
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14:22:20  <jesusabdullah>and I'm all like, "don't you talk to ME about mornings"
14:23:19  <jjjohnny>im up before the chickens and the sun
14:23:31  <jesusabdullah>yeah you are
14:24:57  <jjjohnny>GOOD HUMOUR AMERICA
14:24:57  <LOUDBOT>LOWER YOUR CHOLESTEROL OR FACE MY ROBOT ARMY
14:25:12  <jesusabdullah>lulz
14:25:16  <jesusabdullah>my mom takes lipitor now
14:25:20  <jesusabdullah>apparently it works wonders
14:25:33  <jesusabdullah>good to know as I'm sure I'll also have cholestorol problems at her age
14:26:27  <jjjohnny>u gotta eat right is all, cholesterol is essential
14:26:34  <jjjohnny>especially saturated fats
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14:31:21  <jesusabdullah>mom actually eats p good, not like me at all
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14:36:20  <jesusabdullah>good mooooorning jcrugzz !
14:36:37  <jesusabdullah>The signs at that studio around the corner said so!
14:36:54  <jesusabdullah>I'm skeptical though due to severe lack of breakfast croissants
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15:07:13  <jcrugzz>jesusabdullah: lol just saw this. yay morning talk shows
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15:10:24  <jjjohnny>jesusabdullah: you may be able to find pre-scripted eye glasses at a walgreens or such like
15:11:42  <jjjohnny>they have em for reading / far sighted vision, maybe they make em for near sighted too
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15:20:29  <greweb>Any way we can make "Light Table" working with Browserify ?
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15:30:36  <mikolalysenko>has anyone had any first hand experience with instagram?
15:30:36  <mikolalysenko>err not instagram, I mean light table
15:30:36  <mikolalysenko>wow my brain is malfunctioning this morning
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15:31:35  <mikolalysenko>it looks a little gimmicky, but maybe it is good for demonstrations/educational stuff
15:34:54  <jory>I believe it was largely inspired by the Bret Victor presentation Inventing On Principle, and the live editing he did therein.
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16:31:41  <Domenic_>Is Light Table any good?
16:31:48  <Domenic_>I downloaded it it seems like just a text editor
16:36:26  <dominictarr>it's not even open source!
16:43:26  <ednapiranha>dominictarr: i thought they open sourced it!
16:45:05  <prettyrobots>(node) warning: Recursive process.nextTick detected. This will break in the next version of node. Please use setImmediate for recursive deferral.
16:45:20  <prettyrobots>Is there any way to turn that into an exception instead of a warning and get a stack trace?
16:46:14  <jory>ednapiranha: Yeah, they opened it yesterday.
16:46:23  <jory>Kind of feel bad for the kickstarter supporters now though.
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16:47:56  <dominictarr>http://feedopensource.com/
16:48:25  <dominictarr>ednapiranha, oh, they did now. no source link from their website though
16:48:36  <jcrugzz>some clojure goodness
16:49:22  <jory>If you're willing to try Light Table, you should really just bite the bullet and go with Emacs.
16:50:57  <AvianFlu>BLASPHEMY
16:52:23  <dominictarr>everyone, this is my new thing: http://feedopensource.com/
16:52:57  <marcello3d>dominictarr: curious idea. needs more bling/flash, feels very lawyerish and boring :-)
16:56:31  <dominictarr>marcello3d, what would you change?
16:57:16  <dominictarr>why do you say "lawyerish", especially?
16:58:37  <jory>Sexy design sells ideas.
16:58:50  <jory>No matter how good or bad the idea.
16:58:54  <jory>And vice versa.
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17:04:57  <marcello3d>it feels very impersonal, I guess
17:05:01  <marcello3d>like a business contract
17:05:25  <marcello3d>using 'we' and mostly talking in the abstract
17:05:44  <spion>dominictarr, the idea is very exciting
17:05:48  <spion>:D
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17:05:51  <marcello3d>maybe the font plays a part?
17:06:18  <marcello3d>it's unclear who the target audience is
17:07:41  <dominictarr>marcello3d, hmm, maybe I should change to comic sans
17:07:47  <dominictarr>spion, thanks!
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17:11:04  <ednapiranha>dominictarr: but as usual.. i'll just wait til everyone else abuses light table and tells me whether it's worth it or not
17:11:05  <ednapiranha>:)
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17:11:52  <jesusabdullah>derf
17:11:59  <jesusabdullah>how's erryone?
17:12:16  <jesusabdullah>The CN team's doing their standup so
17:12:20  <jesusabdullah>I'm just chillin'
17:15:00  <defunctzombie>dominictarr: people are very bad at estimating costs
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17:19:08  <jesusabdullah>thlorenz: where ARE you?
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17:19:36  <thlorenz>at Times Square 4, are you in NYC?
17:19:47  <jesusabdullah>thlorenz: Yeah I'm in the other building
17:19:57  <jesusabdullah>thlorenz: it SOUNDS like I'm gitting up TS4 after lunch tho
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17:22:38  <dominictarr>defunctzombie, yes. that is why you do it in short iterations.
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18:22:41  <ogd>substack: did i accidentally awake the dragon of technical debt in pushover?
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18:35:18  <ogd>groundwater: i am making progress on the deploy stuff we talked about
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18:36:37  <ogd>groundwater: https://github.com/maxogden/taco right now it accepts git pushes, does npm install, and then generates a config for mon + mongroup, then runs the mongroup start command. next is to hook it up to my nginx module
18:37:09  <ogd>groundwater: also all of the steps beyond the push + npm install are going to be pluggable so that you can choose whether or not to do the process monitoring step, nginx, docker, etc
18:37:35  <groundwater>ogd did you see what isaacs said about proxying, if you don't parse the HTTP, node can proxy much faster
18:37:51  <groundwater>i wonder if he poked substack enough to write a 'fast proxy' module
18:37:58  <ogd>groundwater: i benched it https://gist.github.com/maxogden/8312464
18:38:06  <ogd>groundwater: mikeal already wrote one, hostproxy
18:38:09  <ogd>see bottom
18:38:16  <ogd>hostproxy isnt that bad honestly
18:38:18  <groundwater>aha!
18:38:55  <groundwater>100 req/sec (hostproxy) vs 133 req/sec (nginx), not terrible, not great
18:39:29  <ogd>groundwater: at one point i got nginx to do it in 30 seconds, i think i had logging turned on for the run recorded int here
18:39:59  <groundwater>yikes!
18:40:47  <ogd>groundwater: yea so its somsewhere between 125 - 175% perf difference
18:40:53  <groundwater>maybe we can use 'taco' to do the "on demand nodeos" idea
18:41:00  <groundwater>at some point
18:41:10  <ogd>groundwater: yea thats the plan
18:41:31  <groundwater>i'm breaking out some of my scaffolding into modules right now
18:41:32  <ogd>groundwater: also taqueria is open on npm
18:41:48  <groundwater>i figure that's better than the one giant function it is now
18:41:48  <ogd>groundwater: so i think the thing that serves tacos should be a taqueria, whatever that means
18:41:54  <groundwater>lol
18:41:58  <groundwater>i'm confused, but hungry
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18:44:08  <groundwater>so will all taco modules be named after parts of the taco?
18:44:32  <groundwater>require('taco').install( require('rice'), require('beans') ).fold();
18:44:32  <ogd>groundwater: not sure yet
18:44:37  <ogd>well first of all
18:44:45  <ogd>you would never put rice on a taco
18:45:11  <jory>Burrito toppings 101.
18:45:20  <ogd>also that dependency injection api is questionable
18:45:23  <ogd>:P
18:45:43  <groundwater>lol
18:45:56  <groundwater>"tacos are dependency injection"
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19:21:32  <juliangruber>@ogd i want to play in a flying room too!
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19:47:48  <prettyrobots>How do you feel about .npmignore?
19:47:55  <prettyrobots>https://github.com/jindw/xmldom/pull/71#issuecomment-31967413
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19:48:23  <prettyrobots>I don't know. I don't mind putting my tests up to NPM. Others seem to mind. What you your *feels* tell you to do?
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19:52:58  <coderzach>prettyrobots: is space really the issue?
19:53:07  <prettyrobots>coderzach: Right?
19:53:09  <coderzach>seems super silly
19:53:14  <prettyrobots>coderzach: I know.
19:53:36  <coderzach>I guess it's nice when I need to copy my modules to a floppy
19:54:02  <prettyrobots>I feel like I should close it because it's probably getting "me too" comments from people who can understand the issue.
19:54:09  <Domenic_>tests can make downloads take longer and are annoying when committing node_modules to git
19:54:38  <Domenic_>I think .npmignore is unequivocally good for getting rid of .travis.yml and similar
19:54:57  <prettyrobots>Okay.
19:55:39  <prettyrobots>Silly versus annoying.
19:55:52  <prettyrobots>Anyone else want to take sides?
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19:57:49  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: sounds great! rok@kowalski.gd
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20:05:36  <grncdr>prettyrobots: how big are the tests?
20:05:48  <prettyrobots>Neither Issac, Max, James nor Dominic (Tarr) uses .npmignore.
20:06:02  <prettyrobots>grncdr: Sadly, very few tests actually.
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20:06:18  <grncdr>meh I say
20:08:02  <grncdr>merge it and add a reminder to revert it in a month, just to see if anybody still cares ;)
20:08:38  <grncdr>personally I like having the tests on hand so I can go poke at them if I'm not sure how a module works and the docs are bad
20:08:51  <grncdr>or if I'm trying to do something the author didn't plan on
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20:09:30  <grncdr>the whole tests-as-machine-checkable-docs angle
20:10:43  <grncdr>just close it with this: http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdjf6wzVaZ1rknwigo1_400.gif
20:11:40  <rowbit>substack, pkrumins: Encoders down: 50.57.72.69 (free7), 50.57.174.117 (dev2), 166.78.104.64 (dev-ie10-2)
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20:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 3, free: 44]
20:29:37  <prettyrobots>grncdr: Yes. I like having the tests around so I can check that I've build the package correctly.
20:29:47  <prettyrobots>Or I've liked having them around in the past.
20:29:58  <prettyrobots>grncdr: And the reminder, that's pretty wicked. Thank you.
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20:53:33  <jjjohnny>prettyrobots: re yr last tweet
20:53:41  <jjjohnny>are you talking about low level performance?
20:53:46  <jjjohnny>or features?
20:54:03  <jjjohnny>cuz leveldb does features right by making them modular components
20:54:24  <prettyrobots>But, it can't do an r-tree.
20:54:31  <prettyrobots>Nor can it do a Merkle tree.
20:55:14  <prettyrobots>Thus, it's more about implementation direction and allowing the Strata implementation to be itself.
20:56:26  <prettyrobots>Strata exposes a b-tree, while LevelDB is still mostly a key/value store.
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20:59:45  <soldair>prettyrobots: dont sell it short. its a sorted key value store and subject to those limitations. you can freely use another leveldown store for just a sublevel of your data if you want to
21:01:19  <prettyrobots>soldair: We're talking about: https://twitter.com/bigeasy/status/421381463506821121
21:01:56  <soldair>prettyrobots: i see. exactly my opinion i guess =)
21:02:07  <prettyrobots>jjjohnny: It's not really performance of features, it's really about capacities.
21:03:38  <jjjohnny>prettyrobots: if you can do k/v over strata, or merkle/b trees over k/v then I suppose you can keep parity with leveldb, if that is important
21:04:05  <jjjohnny>i am not the right consultant for this
21:05:15  <prettyrobots>jjjohnny: I'm saying that I need to pursue new "capacities" in the Strata implementation. When I get them, then it will enable new modules. Probably more important than increased compatibility, like binary compatibility with LevelDB.
21:06:34  <prettyrobots>Pure JavaScript spatial indexes would be better for Node.js to get sooner than a *perfect* pure JavaScript LevelDB clone.
21:07:08  <prettyrobots>jjjohnny: My conversations with you regarding LevelDB have been *very* helpful.
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21:09:02  <soldair>prettyrobots: patterns like level-geo fall short for you? jjjohnny i'm just so curious now sorry for butting in
21:11:17  <prettyrobots>soldair: I'd have to look. There is an r-tree in this, but I don't know that it is paged. It might be in memory, which is fine.
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21:15:34  <mikolalysenko>did you know + is not commutative in js?
21:19:47  <Domenic_>of course, {} + []
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21:24:17  <mikolalysenko>or "a" + "b" !== "b" + "a"
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21:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 2, free: 34]
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21:33:51  <jjjohnny>soldair: butt on in and away
21:38:22  <soldair>jjjohnny: ha. things good in the module hood?
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21:39:23  <jjjohnny>MODULE HOOD
21:39:25  <LOUDBOT>SHUT UP YOU OREGON HIPPIE YOU ONLY DRINK WATER ANYWAY
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21:39:51  <jjjohnny>soldair: not bad, trynna get things going. how's baby?
21:39:57  <substack>soldair: http://feedopensource.com/
21:39:59  <substack>exciting times
21:40:08  <jjjohnny>yssss
21:42:02  <jjjohnny>i'd like to see this one go next personally https://github.com/dominictarr/feedopensource/issues/8
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21:49:22  <soldair>jjjohnny: non blocking iterations? you should make a module
21:50:19  <soldair>i need to get more btc to feed people
21:50:30  <jjjohnny>soldair: git branch?
21:53:52  <jesusabdullah>my lack of glasses make me sad
21:54:49  <grncdr>jesusabdullah: left them in SLC?
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22:00:01  <jesusabdullah>grncdr: straight broke them
22:00:15  <jesusabdullah>grncdr: I've had those frames like, geez, nearly a decade
22:00:23  <jesusabdullah>grncdr: the frame finally disintegrated
22:01:04  <grncdr>dang
22:01:17  <grncdr>I know that feel
22:01:50  <substack>I've had my current pair since 2006
22:04:39  <pkrumins>i replaced mine a while ago
22:04:49  <grncdr>I don't wear glasses, but I have had like a few shirts and things for that long
22:05:14  <pkrumins>substack: are yours still with resistors?
22:05:17  <jjjohnny>i can replace my glasses with store bought reading glasses
22:05:21  <ogd>i lost my favorite pair in a ravine in the australian rainforest, substack was there
22:05:30  <grncdr>pair of sandals that I wore for like ~5 years blew out and I was devestated
22:05:30  <grncdr>it took me two years to find another pair that was nearly as good (and they're still not)
22:05:50  <ogd>that was probably the most angry i've been that i can remember
22:06:04  <jjjohnny>cuz im far sighted i see far
22:06:25  <jjjohnny>but breaking or losing a good pair of scripts is demoralizing
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22:08:06  <substack>pkrumins: yep
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22:27:31  <groundwater>grncdr/ogd: what ya'll up to sunday? i'm back saturday night from portland
22:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 5, free: 19]
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22:28:04  <grncdr>no plans
22:28:12  <grncdr>I'd be up for whatever
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22:29:26  <ogd>ditto, pretty sure im free
22:31:55  <grncdr>oh dang, that gazer thing you just retweeted looks handy
22:33:54  <grncdr>groundwater: ogd: coffee shop hacking or something more structured?
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23:04:51  <Raynos>substack: do you have source code for example modular web apps ?
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23:16:03  <Raynos>substack https://github.com/dominictarr/feedopensource/pull/11#issuecomment-31987705
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23:27:50  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 3, free: 21]
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23:32:00  <jjjohnny>THIS IS A JAM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFBD7B90IQQ
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23:59:59  <floatdrop>nfroidure I get same strange feeling while debugging this issue https://github.com/floatdrop/gulp-plumber/issues/5