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00:23:18  <grncdr>just realized ehd is the nick-formerly-known-as-evil-hacker-dude
00:23:38  <grncdr>also trodrigues, it turns out I'm staying in Berlin for a few more days
00:23:48  <grncdr>leaving early Wed. morning now
00:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [free: 8]
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00:24:11  <daleharvey>can I get browserify (+watchify) to implicitly create the output directory
00:24:34  <daleharvey>prefixing everything with mkdir -p dist is kinda annoying
00:24:43  <mmalecki>daleharvey: mkdir -p $dir && browserify ... > $dir/bundle.js
00:24:49  <mmalecki>^ ?
00:24:51  <mmalecki>ahh
00:24:54  <daleharvey>:P
00:25:09  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: which couch version are you running on npmjs.eu?
00:25:17  <mmalecki>robertkowalski: 1.5.0
00:25:49  <robertkowalski>mmalecki: my couch crashes during the replication often. is this a common issue with a workaround?
00:26:31  <mmalecki>robertkowalski: you want http://docs.couchdb.org/en/latest/config/replicator.html#replicator/max_replication_retry_count
00:27:19  <mmalecki>won't prefer it from crashing, but will restart it just fine if you set it to infinity
00:28:29  <mmalecki>s/prefer/prevent/
00:28:35  <mmalecki>^ means I need to go to sleep
00:28:56  <mmalecki>robertkowalski: email me at me@mmalecki.com with the stack traces, etc. if it keeps happening, I'd be glad to help :)
00:30:36  <robertkowalski>thanks man!
00:32:12  <substack>daleharvey: why do you find yourself prefixing commands with mkdirp often?
00:32:28  <substack>*mkdir -p
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00:32:45  <substack>you could put that in a package.json scripts.build entry or some such place
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00:35:18  <daleharvey>not tons, just a minor thing and wondered if there was another way round
00:35:30  <daleharvey>and yeh its part of npm run scripts - https://github.com/daleharvey/pouchdb/commit/19ce10301d1c1cd88f71d5e452a7076552dd9860
00:36:59  <daleharvey>we have switched to a full browserify workflow, the if (node) stuff got taken out, its working nicely, cheers
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00:43:20  <daleharvey>is the ability to pass args to npm run being actively worked on or 'never gonna happen' type thing?
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00:51:38  <substack>daleharvey: not sure, but I agree that would be pretty rad
00:51:51  <substack>you could always write a command that would read the package.json scripts field
00:51:55  <substack>`nrun` or some such
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00:52:23  <substack>(or enrun and then use the enron logo)
00:55:32  <daleharvey>lol, would be nice, I think ill just use env vars for now, guessing its not done since its kinda tricky with piping etc
00:56:18  <grncdr>daleharvey: the way `npm run` works is basically handing stuff off to `bash -c`
00:56:50  <grncdr>the more annoying part of implementing argument passing is that the arg parsing for npm is kind of extra special
00:57:11  <grncdr>and happens before the `run` command gets involved
00:57:45  <grncdr>I did figure out how to pass arbitrary arguments when I was actively owrking on npm-exec
00:58:00  <substack>grncdr: oh nifty
00:59:41  <grncdr>hm, I may have never pushed that to github...
01:01:33  <grncdr>oh, yes I did
01:01:42  <grncdr>and it wasn't the arg parsing, so I don't know what I was remembering
01:01:51  <grncdr>anyways this branch: https://github.com/grncdr/npm/commits/issue-3313
01:02:12  <grncdr>and this commit: https://github.com/grncdr/npm/commit/034f73c1c06cc06a646444af649f822ad849d64b
01:05:57  <substack>did all of that end up in npm-exec?
01:06:22  <grncdr>yeah, it actually just depends on npm-exec
01:06:34  <grncdr>so it works as well as npm-exec does
01:06:41  <grncdr>which is not very well at the moment :\
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01:09:35  <grncdr>so the bin/npm-exec script in npm-exec is really just for testing purposes
01:09:55  <grncdr>I was running into issues with getting everything working smoothly enough that I'd want to PR it
01:11:47  <grncdr>supporting, background commands, non-interactive commands, and interactive commands with bashful's eval is not really that easy
01:12:26  <grncdr>but honestly I've just not had the time to figure out what's not working this time, and all my free hacking time is going towards other projects :(
01:15:24  <substack>backgrounded commands do work in bashful now though
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02:49:53  <ryanflorence>substack: do you have a some project motivating bashful?
02:49:58  <ryanflorence>s/a //
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02:52:39  <substack>ryanflorence: not particularly
02:52:58  <substack>ryanflorence: eventually I want to make a full unix shell for the browser to teach the command-line
02:53:03  <substack>and to use in games maybe
02:53:12  <ryanflorence>sounds fun
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02:58:00  <ryanflorence>I had no idea so many people used windows for web development until I released ember-tools. I wish I could just make bash + node scripts + make for the tools. bashful would be fantastic
02:58:39  <substack>it's nearly there for the basic stuff you might see in a package.json scripts field
03:00:12  <defunctzombie>isaacs: I read those github threads and the revet threads... holy crap how many people have opinions
03:00:38  <defunctzombie>isaacs: if only they would fix bugs and issues with all those opinions :)
03:02:29  <ryanflorence>i think its easier to fix bugs w/o opinions sometimes :P
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03:43:11  <ogd>ryanflorence: yea we wanna emulate node and run nodeschool workshops in browsers
03:43:47  <ryanflorence>add in tim's work with js-git and you'll be breeding an a new kind of developer.
03:43:55  <ryanflorence>man, my typing is so off today
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05:38:02  <DTrejo>ryanflorence: i have an idea for you: no more articles! then no more problems haha
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06:34:48  <ryanflorence>is there a way to ask where the global modules are installed to?
06:34:55  <ryanflorence>npm install -g foo
06:35:05  <ryanflorence>and then in a script find out where that's at
06:38:54  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: maybe npm config ls -l
06:40:16  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: also look at require.resolve
06:40:25  <ryanflorence>hmm "cache"
06:40:28  <ryanflorence>points to ~/.npm
06:40:44  <jesusabdullah>I feel like I've done this before
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06:41:54  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: process.mainModule.paths
06:41:59  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: look at that
06:42:08  <ryanflorence>ooh, require.resolve(module) tells me where it is
06:42:10  <ryanflorence>that's all I need
06:42:19  <jesusabdullah>oh, g2g then
06:44:17  <ryanflorence>process.mainModule isn't a thing in my node
06:45:08  <ryanflorence>interesting, if the package has no "main" entry then it can't resolve
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06:46:30  <ryanflorence>nvm, I can't resolve nothin'
06:46:57  <jesusabdullah>it's different in the repl
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06:47:39  <jesusabdullah>p sure resolve needs to work for require to work
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06:47:51  <ryanflorence>yeah, I can't require stuff either
06:47:54  <ryanflorence>npm install -g whatever
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06:48:03  <ryanflorence>$ node ... require('whatever')
06:48:18  <ryanflorence>maybe my paths are messed up for requiring globals installs?
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06:49:08  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: I can tell you from experience that futzing with alternate file requiring models is a pretty deep rabbit hole
06:49:42  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: https://github.com/bigcompany/resource/blob/master/lib/load.js
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06:50:18  <ryanflorence>jesusabdullah: my script is installing a module globally for the user, and then I need to point my script at a directory in that module
06:50:26  <ryanflorence>I'm not messing with alternate file requiring
06:50:37  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: interesting
06:51:13  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: you can probably hardcode that path, or try to programmatically get the $prefix and reconstruct it for more robustness
06:51:47  <jesusabdullah>ryanflorence: hardcoding the path will catch the vast majority of linux and mac installs
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07:12:23  <ryanflorence>jesusabdullah: I decided to be ghetto
07:12:28  <ryanflorence>checked for node_modules in pwd
07:12:31  <ryanflorence>if not there, create
07:12:32  <ryanflorence>npm install
07:12:36  <ryanflorence>then I know where its at for sure
07:12:39  <ryanflorence>then clean up
07:12:46  <ryanflorence>this is probably awful
07:21:39  <ryanflorence>jesusabdullah: it works!
07:21:47  <jesusabdullah>nice
07:22:35  <ryanflorence>I just replaced yeoman in some ways I think
07:22:44  <ryanflorence>$ originate ember my-app
07:22:56  <ryanflorence>installs loom-origin-ember into node_modules
07:23:09  <ryanflorence>then runs the generators to create a new project in my-app
07:23:13  <ryanflorence>then cleans up
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09:41:34  <Xotic750>Good day
09:41:51  <Xotic750>I am trying ci.testling for the first time but my project status does not move past pending.
09:42:04  <Xotic750>Is there some kind of log to see what is happening?
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10:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 23]
10:43:33  <ehd>success https://github.com/ehd/node-ds4 – somehow feels good starting by only exposing the transform function instead of a transform stream, because someone else can do it using e.g. this + through
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10:57:18  <ehd>grncdr :D
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11:23:24  <grncdr>are you guys in the office tomorrow?
11:23:51  <grncdr>I think I'll have some time to finish this thing and send it in the morning
11:23:53  <grncdr>ehd ^^
11:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 63]
11:24:16  <grncdr>for now, I'm going to the naschtmarkt (don't know if I spelled that right)
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11:25:14  <ehd>grncdr: i won't be there, but trodrigues will be
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16:45:36  <dominictarr_>isaacs, someone emailed me saying they wanted to translate node's docs into portuguese
16:45:46  <dominictarr_>(I don't know why the emailed me)
16:46:03  <dominictarr_>but anyway, I made a encouraging reply and cc'd you
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17:01:21  <defunctzombie>substack: dominictarr_: https://github.com/defunctzombie/libuv.js
17:01:30  <defunctzombie>started on something I hope will turn into some science
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17:16:27  <dominictarr_>defunctzombie, ONLY ONE ENORMOUS OPINION
17:16:37  <defunctzombie>hahaha
17:17:18  <dominictarr_>this reminds me of something i was thinking about the other day
17:18:02  <dominictarr_>trolling the other frontend package managers by making a common.js-less append script tags thing for the server side
17:19:20  <defunctzombie>wut
17:19:20  <dominictarr_>then you can use bower for serverside code.
17:19:31  <defunctzombie>hahahaha
17:20:01  <dominictarr_>then, compile every node module with browserify --standalone, and put it on bower
17:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 15]
17:24:51  <defunctzombie>dominictarr_: I think with this libuv.js stuff you can try stuff like coros and threads and other crazy stuff
17:27:58  <dominictarr_>cool, this will be great for the crazies who have been getting bored with node's stability recently
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17:57:05  <dominictarr_>substack, this might be a go http://www.ebay.com/itm/BeagleBone-3-5-LCD-Touchscreen-Cape-LCD3-BB-Bone-LCD3-01-Rev-A1-/121092757019?pt=US_Laptop_Screens_LCD_Panels&hash=item1c31b0d61b
17:57:19  <dominictarr_>beaglebone, plus you can get screens for it.
18:00:33  <mmalecki>aww yeah. libuv.js.
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18:23:50  <dominictarr_>substack, this could be promising too http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/tft-serial-display-18
18:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 17]
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18:35:34  <substack>dominictarr_: so one of the big problems with truncating results is that the search is ALSO really over-active
18:35:39  <substack>so you get SO MUCH spam
18:35:48  <substack>and all the results on the first (and only) page are useless
18:36:24  <substack>having one of the terms in the name should count for 1000x
18:36:31  <substack>and the desc should count for 100x
18:36:44  <substack>and having a term in the readme should count for 1x
18:37:09  <substack>part of the reason for this is how modules should do exactly 1 thing well
18:37:24  <substack>and if they are doing lots of unrelated shit and stuffing that into the readme somewhere I don't even want to know about it
18:37:28  <substack>because I just won't use that module
18:38:11  <substack>I don't actually think that the finding modules problem is related to textual search
18:38:34  <substack>it's much more about the network effects of using modules in a style that you like or written by people who you already trust
18:39:32  <substack>the full text index seems mostly just like a distraction
18:39:41  <mikolalysenko>it would be nice if there was some kind of review process for modules
18:39:56  <mikolalysenko>so you could give positive/negative feedback and some sort of rating
18:41:21  <substack>I don't think universal ratings are necessarily going to map well to what we want or need though
18:41:34  <substack>what npmd lets us do that is really interesting and unique is to generate personalized search results
18:41:49  <substack>because we already have the complete index and we can also save which modules are getting installed
18:42:16  <mikolalysenko>what if you could use npmd to do code completion/module searching in an editor?
18:42:32  <mikolalysenko>combined with some kind of static analysis on the modules of course...
18:43:00  <mikolalysenko>you can start typing a require("..") and you can tab complete the module name and get some info about the package
18:43:28  <substack>maybe, but really specific to which editor you already like and use
18:43:34  <substack>ok what is up with this: LevelUPError: Installed version of LevelDOWN (0.6.2) does not match required version (~0.5.0)
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18:50:02  <brianloveswords>dominictarr_: when I do `npmd --sync`, what is it counting? Is that percent done?
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18:51:10  <substack>brianloveswords: percent of the registry sync'd
18:52:06  <brianloveswords>Ahhh rad, thanks substack
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18:58:42  <dominictarr_>the npmd sync thing is not obvious to people. many people are confused or asking questions about that...
18:58:51  <dominictarr_>need to make that more obvious...
19:02:12  <ogd>dominictarr_: can you write a section with commands for absolute beginners that shows how to switch from npm to npmd?
19:02:24  <ogd>dominictarr_: the docs right now make lots of assumptions and im not sure i quite understand everything
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19:04:34  <guybrush>does npmd also work with git-repos?
19:05:00  <dominictarr_>guybrush, yes, just fixing a bug with that this minute
19:05:12  <guybrush>woah nice
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19:06:02  <defunctzombie>mmalecki: jesus... so many stars and the project doesn't even do anything yet
19:06:39  <guybrush>mikolalysenko: i think requirebin could be extended with such functionality relatively easy, that is code-completion when typing require
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19:12:45  <mmalecki>defunctzombie_zz: haha. it's certainly a great idea.
19:15:31  <mikolalysenko>guybrush: that would be pretty awesome
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19:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 10]
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20:09:33  <substack>ogd: plans to have https://github.com/maxogden/bytewiser on nodeschool.io?
20:09:35  <substack>I can add it
20:10:02  <substack>we should also add that express thing //cc brianloveswords
20:10:03  <ogd>substack: yea its ready
20:10:06  <ogd>substack: just half done
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20:10:10  <substack>cool
20:10:19  <ogd>substack: brianloveswords was gonna add some for bitwise ops
20:10:58  <substack>oh groovy
20:11:01  <substack>we can put it up there though
20:11:06  <substack>if it's playable
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20:19:17  <brianloveswords>substack: +1 for the express thing. ogd, I gotta to work on my bitwise stuff, it's not ready yet!
20:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 5]
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20:43:04  <substack>brianloveswords: ok it's live
20:43:08  <substack>http://nodeschool.io
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20:43:23  <substack>haha whoops, fixing the links
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20:44:12  <substack>oh hah I'm still using the screenshot for functional on bytewiser
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21:05:25  <brianloveswords>substack: rad!! Thanks for updating that stuff.
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21:06:58  <substack>yeah I think we should just put everything up there and then clean it up later when it gets messy
21:07:10  <substack>instead of being exclusive from the start
21:07:26  <substack>because that's the nodeiest way to do it
21:10:14  <brianloveswords>That sounds good to me.
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22:30:59  <isaacs>rvagg: hey
22:31:14  <isaacs>rvagg: re "getting modules into a CDN" it's not so simple for people to help out with that.
22:31:48  <isaacs>rvagg: i mean, not without someone being involved very heavily, having ssh admin rights, etc.
22:32:27  <isaacs>Too often, "We want to help! Share details! Let me send pull requests!" misses the point that some tasks have to be done by a dedicated person who makes it their fulltime job.
22:32:31  <rvagg>isaacs: yeah, but there are alternative approaches that perhaps members of the community could contribute towards -- like writing a proxy in front of couch to redirect attachments to a CDN and everything else into couch proper perhaps
22:32:44  <isaacs>rvagg: taht's like 2% of the problem, though
22:32:47  <rvagg>isaacs: yeah but this isn't just about tasks per se, it's about process openness
22:32:53  <isaacs>rvagg: manging the communication is more work than just writing that bit myself.
22:33:22  <isaacs>rvagg: and regardless, whoever writes that thing has to be willing to maintain and run it, and that's going to fall on me ultimately anyway.
22:33:29  <rvagg>"we have a plan" sucks for managing a healthy community, show us the plan, help us feel involved even if you have to trick us to feeling involved, otherwise this just devolves into crappy corporate overlordship
22:34:06  <st_luke>rvagg: how does it devolve into crappy corporate overlordship when there's no corporate master?
22:35:13  <isaacs>rvagg: Here is the plan: I've already moved all of the tarballs into Manta, and a continuous mcouch replicator is keeping them going in
22:35:49  <isaacs>rvagg: I'm leaning towards fastly, but i haven't made up my mind yet.
22:36:02  <isaacs>depends on what's easiest to set up. that's mostly a matter of writing VCL and doing operational setup stuff.
22:36:07  <isaacs>there's close to zero code to write.
22:36:20  <isaacs>the other option is maxcdn
22:36:29  <isaacs>Replication from the main registry will be unaffected.
22:36:58  <isaacs>And the little code that DOES have to be written all has to go through me anyway.
22:37:55  <isaacs>i mean, this is not a software dev task. this is an operational deployment migration task.
22:38:07  <isaacs>anyway, gotta run
22:39:00  <st_luke>that's kind of the point I try to make with people, it's just boring ops stuff where the actual work is logistics
22:39:01  <rvagg>ok, fine, but can you at least appreciate how this comes across from the outside? we'll wake up this morning and it'll be "hey, we've done all this magic and now everything's changed and new and you have to redo all your mental models about how this works, but it's way better, we promise!"
22:39:16  <rvagg>you really need to take people along for the journey
22:40:06  <st_luke>the magic carpet ride
22:41:01  <rvagg>and in the meantime people perceive little activity going in to solving their particular problems so you end up with divergent approaches if not blatant forks
22:41:05  <rvagg>consider the popularity of npmd
22:41:27  <isaacs>r
22:43:36  <isaacs>rvagg: yeah, a blog post will be coming very soon, and i'm gonna talk a lot about it on wednesday at Node Summit
22:43:56  <isaacs>rvagg: npmd is actually rad. id' like to incorporate some of the ideas in that into npm 2.0
22:44:10  <isaacs>that was actually the original intent of the .npm cache folder
22:44:42  <isaacs>but anyway, gotta run. i'll tell you more later
22:44:59  <isaacs>rvagg: npm config set registry=http://fastly.npmjs.org/; npm config set strict-ssl=false
22:45:12  <isaacs>rvagg: just for funsies :)
22:45:21  <isaacs>or you can use https and no strict-ssl
22:45:26  <isaacs>but the strict-ssl doesn't work
22:45:35  * isaacs&
22:45:35  <LOUDBOT>GODDAMN IT I HATE THAT UNIX COMMANDS DONT WORK IF YOU CAPSLOCK
22:48:26  <rvagg>nice, that's pretty snappy from down here
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23:00:00  <mmalecki>isaacs: I think you're underestimating people who could help with planning this operational deployment migration task.
23:00:32  <mmalecki>isaacs: I mean, why keep it inside Joyent. create an issue describing how it's going to happen and let people look at it.
23:02:06  <mmalecki>isaacs: making the process more open is one of my motivations behind advocating for use of haproxy with npmjs
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23:24:03  <rowbit>Daily usage stats: [developer: 7, free: 571]
23:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 17]
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23:42:51  <st_luke>mmalecki: what do you mean by 'inside joyent' ?
23:45:22  <mmalecki>er.
23:45:24  <mmalecki>LOL.
23:45:45  <mmalecki>isaacs: s/inside joyent/inside whereever those discussions usually happen/g
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23:54:14  <rvagg>you mean "the illumaniti" don't you mmalecki?
23:54:15  <st_luke>mmalecki: it's really a lot less formal than people are making it out to be
23:54:35  <st_luke>its like the nodejitsu blog post and then a handful of instant messages saying "did you get a chance to do this yet?" "no not yet, should get some time soon, won't take long."
23:54:36  <st_luke>etc
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23:57:25  <mmalecki>st_luke: dunno, I usually create an issue with details and everything
23:57:32  <mmalecki>rvagg: MAYBE
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