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00:13:00  <substack>I have just noticed that whenever something toxic happens in open source it is almost always instigated from somebody involved with rails. :(
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00:14:22  <hij1nx>substack: any idea on adding to the path ^^
00:15:17  <hij1nx>substack: im browserifying from a script in my package, `npm start`, which builds the bundle
00:16:11  <hij1nx>substack: start: "browserify --debug ./client.js > ./static/js/bundle.js",
00:17:32  <hij1nx>would love to be able to do something like `NODE_PATH=./a;./b browserify ...`
00:17:43  <substack>path?
00:17:52  <hij1nx>where modules resove to
00:17:59  <hij1nx>so they look in node_modules by default
00:17:59  <substack>node_modules?
00:18:01  <substack>yes
00:18:02  <hij1nx>yeah
00:18:12  <hij1nx>but it would be awesome to be able to add paths to lookup
00:18:27  <substack>I'm not so sure
00:18:27  <hij1nx>so like ./node_modules;./lib
00:18:30  <substack>node used to have that
00:18:34  <substack>but it was a mistake
00:18:36  <hij1nx>yeah
00:18:45  <hij1nx>but with code organization in the browser its differnt
00:19:08  <substack>what makes it different?
00:19:41  <hij1nx>well i organize my code by feature, i dont do the rails thing with /public
00:20:31  <hij1nx>that means each feature is autonomous, but each feature needs to go up a few levels, ../../lib
00:20:53  <hij1nx>when it wants to get to some shared code
00:20:59  <hij1nx>that is explicitly for the client
00:22:05  <hij1nx>but its too domain specific to publish as a public module, so it doesnt go into node_modules
00:22:52  <hij1nx>hmf, maybe thats just an argument for somehow making everything publishable ;)
00:23:17  <substack>you can have more than one node_modules directory
00:23:20  <hij1nx>if its shared enough to go into a lib folder, it could be shared with everyone... but thats optimistic
00:23:22  <substack>why not put one inside of lib?
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00:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 65]
00:24:39  <hij1nx>it just looks odd, but i was also just curious if there was another way that i wasnt aware of
00:24:56  <substack>maybe you could do something besides lib/?
00:25:12  <hij1nx>yep of course
00:29:44  * fallsemoquit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
00:30:18  <jesusabdullah>rails is going through a midlife crisis substack
00:32:37  <hij1nx>substack: jesusabdullah: what in particular?
00:33:59  <substack>hij1nx: whenever I have dug into someone being privledged on the internet, they have all turned out to be involved with rails
00:34:09  <jesusabdullah>Maybe not rails, maybe more ruby, but: that bastille dude that trolls isaac every 6-8 weeks is a ruby guy, the ember guys that are always jerks are railsbros, probably some others
00:34:16  <jesusabdullah>though I admit that it could all just be in my head
00:34:28  <jesusabdullah>I do feel like ruby people are coming to terms with rails not being the new hotness anymore
00:34:29  <substack>ember folk aren't that bad
00:34:34  <jesusabdullah>just like noders will eventually
00:34:55  <jesusabdullah>yeah actually the ember guys talk a liiiiittle shit but they're know what they're talking about and what I've seen looks p solid
00:35:07  <jesusabdullah>I'd like to see better module system stuff but I think they're coming to that
00:35:09  <substack>I've just had a lot of really negative interactions with people involved with rails
00:35:20  <substack>something about how that community works must be really toxic
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00:42:12  <jesusabdullah>There are toxic elements of the node community as well
00:42:26  <substack>yeah :(
00:42:29  <jesusabdullah>they can just take time to properly coalesce
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01:07:27  <jesusabdullah>isaacs: Dang what a shituation to stumble into eh?
01:08:29  <isaacs>jesusabdullah: ugh.
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01:11:03  <jesusabdullah>and yet I can't look away
01:11:14  <jesusabdullah>maybe because I really want this to be an educational moment? idk
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01:18:08  <jesusabdullah>isaacs: no it's funnier to watch you get irritable ;)
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01:20:46  <isaacs>haha
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01:23:03  <jesusabdullah>isaacs: also where else am I suppose to troll noobs?
01:23:49  <isaacs>jesusabdullah: trolling experienced experts is more fun
01:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 16]
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01:24:29  <jesusabdullah>isaacs: I always liked fish in a barrel tho
01:25:24  <AvianPhone>I ONLY LIKE TO TROLL FOR BIGGER FISH, YOU CAN RUN THE BOAT FASTER AND THEY FIGHT HARDER
01:25:24  <LOUDBOT>THROW IT ON THESE F* IDIOTS!!!
01:25:42  <jesusabdullah>Yeah but they don't bite as easy
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01:26:02  <jesusabdullah>Like, one time I trolled Tom Dale a bit, he didn't even react I was so bummed
01:26:31  <AvianPhone>I WAS MAKING AN ACTUAL OFFSHORE OCEAN FISHING REFERENCE
01:26:31  <LOUDBOT>3 PEOPLE SAY YOU HAVE A LOW IQ FIND OUT WHO!
01:26:33  <jesusabdullah>Oh, but I *did* get a core emberjs guy with, "why not just use npm and browserify?"
01:26:36  <jesusabdullah>now that
01:26:37  <jesusabdullah>THAT
01:26:40  <jesusabdullah>was a beautiful thing
01:28:39  <mikolalysenko>jesusabdullah: what did he say?
01:28:58  <jesusabdullah>mikolalysenko: not a fucking thing, he just stared at me incredulously
01:29:29  <mikolalysenko>jesusabdullah: did he actually know what browserify was?
01:29:30  <jesusabdullah>mikolalysenko: ryan florence had to break the spell of "is he serious? what do I say? do I need to be diplomatic? I didn't even want to go there"
01:29:44  <jesusabdullah>Oh yeah, ember's talked about it a number of times
01:29:55  <jesusabdullah>they considered it but they're leaning hard towards bower right now
01:30:03  <jesusabdullah>and "some convention"
01:30:10  <mikolalysenko>bower has a convention?
01:30:47  <mikolalysenko>man, I try really hard to understand why anyone would use bower and it seriously confuses
01:30:51  <jesusabdullah>no, it doesn't at all
01:30:53  <jesusabdullah>that's the thing
01:31:01  <mikolalysenko>I mean you have to install npm to use it in the first place, right?
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01:31:05  <jesusabdullah>ember shit on bower would necessarily need to use some convention
01:31:09  <jesusabdullah>and yeah p sure mikolalysenko
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01:31:24  <jesusabdullah>bower's strength, in a sense, is that it *doesn't* enforce a convention
01:31:37  <mikolalysenko>well, you could do that on npm too, it would just be stupid
01:31:39  <jesusabdullah>so packages can be, well, packaged in most any manner the author sees fit
01:31:57  <mikolalysenko>yeah, but you can already do that on npm...
01:32:00  <mikolalysenko>it is just kind of silly
01:32:13  <substack>npm has strong cultural conventions and expectations
01:32:26  <mikolalysenko>it also does versioning too, which I guess is different than bower
01:32:26  <substack>that are not enforced by the technology at all
01:32:31  <jesusabdullah>Yeah but node also targets a platform with a well-specified package format, npm doesn't particularly care but it's inextricably tied with the node convention of require
01:33:07  <jesusabdullah>bower is intentionally not tied to target any particular convention and the packages are a hodge-podge of global script tags, requirejs, some bastardization of commonjs, etc
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01:33:40  <substack>I don't really see how you can realistically use bower to do much more than install jquery and underscore
01:33:51  <mikolalysenko>substack: same here...
01:34:32  <mikolalysenko>but at a more basic level, I guess I just don't get the point of having a package manager that doesn't do dependencies
01:34:56  <jesusabdullah>Yeah, I dunno
01:35:07  <jesusabdullah>you guys ever use slackware packages?
01:35:11  <jesusabdullah>back in the day?
01:35:14  <jesusabdullah>reminds me of that a little
01:35:30  <jesusabdullah>manageable, but apt users would still whine about how little sense it made
01:36:30  <mikolalysenko>what astounds me about bower is that anyone takes it seriously at all
01:37:09  <mikolalysenko>I mean you have to install npm in the first place to use it, so at best it is just redundant
01:37:38  <mikolalysenko>and the package format is basically the same as npm's...
01:39:34  <mikolalysenko>I wonder what would happen if you put browserify on bower?
01:39:55  <mikolalysenko>or put node in bower? making npm-ception
01:40:56  <mikolalysenko>ah well, I probably just don't get it and am being cross for no reason
01:41:50  <hij1nx>im pretty sure bower is exactly nih
01:42:38  <hij1nx>but who cares, does anyone use it?
01:42:51  <hij1nx>commonJS is pretty successful, i think
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01:43:58  <hij1nx>also, browserify implements it well.
01:44:17  <hij1nx>i wonder if there are any statistics on bower usage
01:45:43  <mikolalysenko>based on my highly nonscientific and biased sampling from local js meetups and hn, it seems like most js devs don't even use any package management all
01:46:15  <mikolalysenko>and they spend a lot of time worrying about frameworks like angular or backbone or something like that...
01:46:57  <substack>it's really silly because the promise of a framework is to help you organize your code
01:47:14  <mikolalysenko>but unpack that a bit, I mean what does that even mean?
01:47:14  <substack>but what you actually want to help organize your code is a module system and package manager
01:47:27  <mikolalysenko>well, that's also pretty vague
01:47:37  <substack>which is what you do everywhere else in programming
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01:47:39  <mikolalysenko>the way I look at package managers is that they map problem descriptions -> code
01:47:53  <substack>that's a good way of framing it
01:48:02  <mikolalysenko>and put them in some standard interface so that they can be composed and scaled up
01:48:03  <hij1nx>mikolalysenko: +1
01:48:11  <mikolalysenko>so simpler problems become more sophisticated problems
01:48:21  <mikolalysenko>I have no idea what problem angular solves
01:48:32  <mikolalysenko>is it data binding? a user interface library for making pretty widgets?
01:48:38  <mikolalysenko>I honestly have no clue
01:48:51  <hij1nx>mikolalysenko: its old thinking
01:48:58  <mikolalysenko>(and not that I think angular is bad, I just don't know what it does really)
01:49:05  <hij1nx>"oh the web needs structure, because there is none"
01:49:13  <hij1nx>but thats just uninformed
01:49:42  <hij1nx>s/web/frontend/
01:49:49  <mikolalysenko>well, what do they mean by structure?
01:49:58  <hij1nx>"fill in the blanks"
01:50:14  <hij1nx>its the difference between "power users" and "engineers"
01:50:34  <hij1nx>most engineers are more like "power users" or operators, they just fill in the blanks
01:51:13  <substack>mikolalysenko: hah I have exactly the same "naive" view of what libraries are supposed to do
01:51:30  <substack>they should accept inputs and produce outputs
01:51:56  <substack>but this feels like a really obscure outlook in some areas of programming
01:52:07  <mikolalysenko>well, maybe they have side effects. but yeah, that's the basic idea
01:52:42  <mikolalysenko>maybe the inputs though are just a bunch of styling paramters that tell it how to create some crud app
01:53:59  <hij1nx>well, fill-in-the-blanks is ok depending on how you look at it i guess.
01:54:06  <hij1nx>i was thinking of rails.
01:54:25  <substack>one thing I really don't get about that approach is when you generate some code but then you go in and edit the results by hand
01:54:31  <substack>all scaffolding falls into that category
01:55:47  <DTrejo>i feel like angular is for declarative data binding
01:56:02  <DTrejo>declarative = do it in the dom
01:56:15  <substack>because you could have just modified the program that generates the code instead of modifying the generated code
01:56:26  <substack>DTrejo: but it's for a lot of other things too
01:56:35  <substack>data binding seems like just one part of that
01:56:47  <substack>and there are libs that just do data binding
01:56:55  <DTrejo>mm, yeah im not particularly informed
01:57:19  <hij1nx>also... it seems like most frameworks are completely anaware of streaming and why its so valuable.
01:58:48  <mikolalysenko>so what if instead of rails you just maintained a few highly modular example project?
01:59:17  <mikolalysenko>and then people could just fork them or whatever
01:59:53  <DTrejo>i think people do do that, but everyone has their own example project haha, and html5 boilerplate
02:02:06  <mikolalysenko>I guess the boilerplate approach works, though I would personally consider it a failure to understand the problem
02:05:01  <mikolalysenko>but there are lots of places where I haven't figured out better solutions either...
02:05:34  <mikolalysenko>in particular, webgl shaders still bother me and it seems like at some level you have to kind of decide on a single vertex format/mega shader to get things done
02:06:36  <mikolalysenko>my current thinking is that the best you can do is just try to make writing the shaders and connecting everything together as painless as possible
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02:13:26  <DTrejo>are you talking to evan wallace at all?
02:13:37  <mikolalysenko>who?
02:13:46  <DTrejo>he's not very internet-y, but madebyevan.com
02:14:02  <DTrejo>some grpahics stuff from before he started working on his startup
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02:14:20  <mikolalysenko>oh that guy, no haven't had any interactions with him personally
02:14:43  <mikolalysenko>he did that bsp merging library based on thibault's method
02:16:05  <mikolalysenko>(a digression, but someday once I get around to it I want to port this thing to javascript: http://www.cs.mtu.edu/~shene/PUBLICATIONS/2008/setops.pdf )
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02:17:06  <DTrejo>yeah he is a boss, he codes up papers for fun
02:17:51  <DTrejo>oh hey you wrote that paper
02:17:52  <DTrejo>nice
02:18:25  <mikolalysenko>yeah, I also know bill thibault who is the guy who wrote the paper that method he implemented is based on...
02:18:49  <mikolalysenko>though the paper I wrote back in 2008 gives a slightly faster method which you can also make numerically exact
02:19:35  <mikolalysenko>the problem with polygon trimming is that you get numerical round off which basically compounds and can cause errors for really complicated meshes
02:19:36  <DTrejo>i don't know much of anything about graphics, but sounds good :)
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02:20:18  <jesusabdullah>GOOD graphics!
02:21:02  <jesusabdullah>Part of the reason ember wants to use it, I think, is because they see it as fertile, unsettled ground
02:21:34  <mikolalysenko>so does ember have a more specific goal than "attract as many users as possible"?
02:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 11]
02:24:54  <jesusabdullah>mikolalysenko: yeah I think so? I think they're basically riffing off backbone but adding bidirectional data binding to the templates
02:25:08  <jesusabdullah>MORE opinions!
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04:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 17]
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05:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 19]
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06:20:22  <jesusabdullah>jden: are you in the bay area?
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06:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 7]
06:29:42  <jden>jesusabdullah: yessir
06:29:58  <jesusabdullah>jden: I should be getting flown in tuesday night, down to meet up?
06:30:02  <jesusabdullah>not sure where yet
06:30:31  <jden>sure. i'm in SF. going to a docker hackday tuesday evening
06:30:46  <jesusabdullah>oh word
06:31:02  <jesusabdullah>well idk exactly what time I'll have as it's for an on-site interview
06:31:05  <jden>you in town for nodesummit? or just go hang
06:31:09  <jden>ahh
06:31:14  <jden>s/go/to/
06:31:54  <jesusabdullah>People keep asking if I'm going to nodesummit
06:32:04  <jesusabdullah>unless someone flies me down there AND gives me a ticket...no
06:32:47  <jden>ha. well, it's a *thing* and it's happening at *roughly the same time*, so you can understand the possible connection
06:33:07  <jesusabdullah>oh yeah totally
06:33:14  <jesusabdullah>it's not just you XD
06:33:25  <jesusabdullah>Hopefully things will go better this time assuming I move
06:33:33  <jesusabdullah>I think I know more people there now
06:33:37  <jesusabdullah>won't live in the ghetto
06:33:46  <jesusabdullah>Which hood do you live in?
06:36:27  <jden>Mission, for the next two mos at least
06:37:13  <jesusabdullah>word
06:37:25  <jesusabdullah>where are you going after that? CfA stuff, or just a lapsing lease?
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06:39:38  <jden>both. Feb I'll be in some other place, then March I get back to the city. but I don't have that part worked out yet
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06:43:15  <jesusabdullah>aha
06:43:17  <jesusabdullah>where to?
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07:16:17  <jden>jesusabdullah: don't know yet. find out in a few weeks
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07:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 0, free: 23]
07:27:12  <jesusabdullah>jden: word
07:27:22  <jesusabdullah>jden: do you know if Anchorage was a chosen city yet?
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08:43:56  <jden>jesusabdullah: not this year:
08:44:08  <jden>http://www.codeforamerica.org/cities/2014-cities/
08:44:38  <jesusabdullah>jden: oh dang, maybe next year :(
08:44:50  <jesusabdullah>jden: one of my friends got in from AK, Becky Boone
08:44:57  <jesusabdullah>jden: if you see her tell her I said hi!
08:45:02  <jden>yes! i met her during the interview process, she's awesome
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08:45:49  <jesusabdullah>word
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18:12:20  <substack>ryanflorence: and the bower resolve function was split out into its own module too https://github.com/eugeneware/bower-resolve
18:12:43  <ryanflorence>substack: sweet
18:13:20  <ryanflorence>you said "and" ... perhaps I missed some earlier conversation?
18:13:41  <substack>on twitter I shared a link to debowerify
18:13:56  <substack>didn't know if you'd seen it yet
18:14:21  <substack>just saw Domenic_'s RT of your ember-tools patches
18:14:44  <ryanflorence>oh, right. thanks.
18:14:56  <substack>and it looks like debowerify and brower-resolve might help getting the bower parts of ember-tools fully automate
18:14:59  <substack>d
18:15:03  <substack>or at least, more fully automated
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18:17:40  <ryanflorence>yeah, thats a goal
18:17:56  <ryanflorence>well, i'd rather a lib/task outside of ember tools did that
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18:23:04  <substack>that's a good way to do it
18:23:20  <substack>I've really been liking how the transforms ecosystem outside of browserify core has been playing out
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18:40:22  <grncdr>substack: did you see the issue I opened on bashful today?
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18:57:46  <jesusabdullah>does bashful still have no concept of stderr?
18:58:46  <grncdr>jesusabdullah: yes, at least it didn't look like it when I was in there today
18:58:55  <jesusabdullah>bummer
18:58:58  <jesusabdullah>someday...
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19:13:14  <pkrumins>when bash works fully in the browser i'll do 10 pushups
19:13:37  <jesusabdullah>only 10?
19:13:50  <jesusabdullah>I bet you could compile bash with emscripten
19:13:58  <jesusabdullah>would probs be slow as fuck but, hey!
19:14:03  <pkrumins>yeah 10 is challenging
19:15:00  <pkrumins>didnt know about emscripten
19:15:39  <pkrumins>ok i'll do 100 :)
19:18:06  <dominictarr_>defunctzombie_zz, you should make git urls point to the commit, not a tag https://github.com/defunctzombie/engine.io-client/blob/v0.5.0-dz0/package.json#L23
19:18:19  <jesusabdullah>orly? I woulda thought emscripten was right up your alley pkrumins !
19:18:44  <dominictarr_>defunctzombie_zz, sorry, I was looking at something old
19:19:10  <pkrumins>jesusabdullah: i love it already but didn't quite know about it earlier
19:19:21  <pkrumins>jesusabdullah: too many interests in too many fields, can't keep track of everything!
19:19:32  <jesusabdullah>you should emscripten bash and then make substack do 100 pushups ;)
19:19:50  <pkrumins>oh and hey guys, check out my new book that was just published by no starch press! http://nostarch.com/perloneliners
19:20:12  <pkrumins>substack: i emscripten bash and you 100 pushups y/n
19:23:01  <dominictarr_>substack could do 100 pushups no problem, he's so light
19:24:03  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [free: 19]
19:24:46  <jesusabdullah>yeah I heard the good news pkrumins !!
19:24:58  <jesusabdullah>pkrumins: is NSP as cool to work with as they are to buy from?
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19:33:42  <pkrumins>jesusabdullah: they are! they take care of everything!
19:43:21  <pkrumins>jesusabdullah: when are you in oakland? nsp are sending 20 books to substack's house
19:43:26  <pkrumins>you can grab a copy
19:43:35  <pkrumins>everyone can grab a copy!
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19:56:27  <jesusabdullah>pkrumins: Sounds like Tuesday night, but there'a pretty good chance I'll be moving back anyway
19:56:45  <jesusabdullah>pkrumins: I'm job hunting due to getting laid off, more than half my prospects are in the bay
19:56:58  <jesusabdullah>actually half exactly
19:57:01  <jesusabdullah>but yeah
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20:19:30  <jesusabdullah>https://github.com/joyent/libuv/commit/804d40ee14dc0f82c482dcc8d1c41c14333fcb48#commitcomment-4738727 ahahahaha
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20:40:37  <jden>jesusabdullah: PRs accepted at https://github.com/jden/CONTRIBUTING.md
20:41:02  <jesusabdullah>jden: I'll be keeping an eye on it, I'm beginning to think I should codify contribution guidelines to my own projects
20:41:21  <jesusabdullah>jden: not that I've had many issues, but I feel like it could streamline things and, y'know, be there if/when I need it
20:41:54  <jden>this libuv thing is obviously an inflamatory issue, but even on a super micro level
20:41:58  <jden>clarification helps
20:42:08  <jden>eg, if i'm randomly reading through source and I see a typo,
20:42:16  <jden>should i bother making a PR?
20:43:18  <jesusabdullah>yeah def
20:43:32  <jesusabdullah>I think I'm gonna write one up
20:44:59  <jden>awesome. link me when you do, I'll add it to RESOURCES.md
20:50:16  <jesusabdullah>cool
20:50:23  <jesusabdullah>I might flake but if I don't I'll do that
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21:12:16  <grncdr>pkrumins: I will remember these promised 10 push-ups
21:12:40  <grncdr>not that I have any time to work on bash-in-the-browser really, but it's good motivation
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21:36:51  <jesusabdullah>http://imgur.com/Btt8ZQX
21:36:56  <jesusabdullah>I made a thing ^^
21:37:16  <jesusabdullah>ahahaha I like how the date is still stuck
21:37:19  <jesusabdullah>go me
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23:26:23  <trodrigues>jesusabdullah: needs moar doge
23:26:30  <jesusabdullah>trodrigues: nowai
23:26:39  <jesusabdullah>trodrigues: there is already 2x doge
23:27:56  <jesusabdullah>haha
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23:28:30  <trodrigues>there's never enough doge
23:28:44  <jesusabdullah>sup thlorenz
23:28:49  <jesusabdullah>we were just discussing doge
23:29:00  <trodrigues>npm install doge
23:29:01  <trodrigues>wow
23:29:04  <trodrigues>such package
23:29:09  <trodrigues>much ehd
23:29:58  <jesusabdullah>holy shit this package is awesome
23:30:08  * mmaleckijust published his first frontend package
23:30:28  <mmalecki>browserify is seriously awesome: https://github.com/mmalecki/knockout-crdt-observable-array
23:30:30  <trodrigues>abandon all hope
23:31:03  <jesusabdullah>mmalecki: oh sick I've been thinking about doing this kinda thing w/ ember
23:31:08  <trodrigues>that reminds me, I need to do some experiments at putting an infrastructure together to get rid of some rails being used just because asset pipeline
23:31:12  <mmalecki>NO EMBER
23:31:12  <LOUDBOT>PEPPER SPRAY IS JUST SLOTHFUL HIPPIE REPELLANT
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23:31:40  <trodrigues>I've been collecting bookmarks and ideas and crap and need to come up with something coherent
23:31:50  <mmalecki>jesusabdullah: ember.js scares the shit out of me
23:32:15  <mmalecki>jesusabdullah: all the weird JS shit they do
23:32:26  <mmalecki>jesusabdullah: and all the getters and setters with lots of DOM operations
23:32:28  * mmaleckishivers
23:34:02  <jesusabdullah>yeah I can understand that
23:34:07  <jesusabdullah>but it's the new hotness
23:34:24  <trodrigues>mmalecki: what? getters and setters with DOM operations?
23:35:21  <jesusabdullah>trodrigues: it does data binding so it probably uses get/set trickery so that it can update a view to match a change to an object
23:35:21  <mmalecki>trodrigues: dunno. last time I used ember it was a bloated piece of shit where setting a property could result in a write to DOM
23:35:35  <jesusabdullah>mmalecki: my impression is that it's a lot better now
23:35:44  <jesusabdullah>mmalecki: though the tooling still sucks. They know.
23:35:51  <jesusabdullah>mmalecki: but they can't agree on how to do it!
23:36:02  <mmalecki>really? did they kick Yehuda yet?
23:36:12  <jesusabdullah>nah he's been there the whole time
23:36:17  <jesusabdullah>it's still all yahado all the time
23:36:21  <jesusabdullah>it's just been MORE time
23:37:02  <mmalecki>right. simple equation right there.
23:38:00  <jesusabdullah>ALL YAHADO ALL THE TIME
23:38:00  <LOUDBOT>SMELLS LIKE A TUNA ORGY IN THIS KITCHEN
23:38:33  <trodrigues>mmalecki: that's really weird. I haven't really tried myself, so I don't know
23:38:50  <trodrigues>but I have a look at the docs every now and then and I kinda like the evolution of it
23:39:06  <trodrigues>no idea about code quality/speed/whatever though
23:39:25  <trodrigues>TBH, I've been working mostly with angular for the past few months and tons of shit about it also scares me
23:39:46  <trodrigues>at the end of the day it all makes sense but sometimes it's hard to figure out what's not working, particularly when writing tests
23:40:28  <ehd>i'm writing all my stuff in nasm these days, it's so random
23:41:03  <trodrigues>go back to your PS4 controller
23:41:29  <trodrigues>get that shit hooked up to a drone ASAP
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23:41:49  <jesusabdullah>oh God angular is horrible
23:42:06  <jesusabdullah>I actually used it, it's half "oh that's a good idea" and "HOLY SHIT LORD HELP ME"
23:44:26  <trodrigues>haha
23:44:47  <trodrigues>there is a bit of magic there, and when your app grows it's kinda scary to see all that magic in place
23:44:57  <trodrigues>but sometimes it just gives you so much good
23:45:42  <ehd>might just destroy this controller while trying to find out what maps to gyroscope/accelerometer exactly..
23:46:07  <jesusabdullah>trodrigues: and then you use $scope.watch . What could possibly go wrong?
23:46:10  <trodrigues>I was trying to figure out how to build a feature yesterday and I was just picking others in the office for ideas and they go like "well but because of bindings that just happens" and I was like http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y462/staffpicks/Animated_GIFs/2qdy5o0.gif
23:46:49  <trodrigues>jesusabdullah: scope.$watch is allright. the problem is when you trigger $apply/$digest in the wrong place :p
23:47:16  <trodrigues>but that's actually one of the very few situations where it's really good at telling you what you're doing wrong
23:47:37  <trodrigues>in a lot of others is just like "nope, not working, fuck you"
23:48:06  <trodrigues>anyway, I feel like all be good when Object.observe is a widespread and stable thing
23:48:22  <jesusabdullah>yeah probs
23:48:24  <jesusabdullah>es6?
23:48:56  <trodrigues>I guess...I was actually trying to use it on Canary recently and it was horribly broken for some reason
23:49:34  <jesusabdullah>bummer
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23:52:34  <trodrigues>funny enough, I was trying to use it to debug an angular issue :p