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00:20:47  <dools> /win 2
00:20:49  <dools>urr
00:20:53  <dools>BUSTED
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00:31:52  <Raynos>substack: "Raynos: the emitter.on(id + ':offer', cb) stuff is a bit weird" Any better suggestions
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02:23:06  <Raynos>WHos in portland
02:23:47  <Raynos>im probably going to be there for a bit
02:26:22  * chrisdickinsonwaves
02:26:31  <chrisdickinson>Raynos: from when to when?
02:26:41  <Raynos>3 hours
02:26:43  <Raynos>at the airport
02:26:46  <Raynos>once in the morning
02:26:49  <Raynos>once in the afternoon
02:26:56  <Raynos>2 hours in the morning, 3 in the afternoon
02:26:59  <chrisdickinson>ah
02:27:04  <Raynos>:D
02:27:14  <Raynos>when I say a bit I mean a bit
02:27:17  <chrisdickinson>haha
02:27:34  <Raynos>prob the 24th
02:27:44  <Raynos>hacking at the airport fun times.
02:27:50  <chrisdickinson>well, when you're in the air wave at the ant that looks like he's programming javascript, that's probably me
02:28:04  <Raynos>:D
02:28:14  <Raynos>btw
02:28:19  <Raynos>we should collab on some modules
02:28:27  <chrisdickinson>yes
02:28:58  <chrisdickinson>agreed.
02:28:59  <Raynos>we should
02:29:04  <Raynos>build the best MVC framework ever
02:29:26  <chrisdickinson>haha, comprised of a million modules.
02:29:33  <Raynos>no
02:29:35  <Raynos>one big fat one
02:29:37  <Raynos>with everything
02:29:41  <Raynos>build it on top of hoarders
02:29:55  <chrisdickinson>"to get started, download all of npm"
02:29:58  <chrisdickinson>"then run java"
02:30:08  <Raynos>jesusabdullah: hoarders MVC. It needs to be build
02:30:16  <Raynos>chrisdickinson: use a JS -> Java compiler
02:30:32  <chrisdickinson>or,
02:30:48  <chrisdickinson>write a web framework that's served out of g++ while it compiles C++
02:30:58  <Raynos>?
02:31:13  <Raynos>srsly though
02:31:15  <chrisdickinson>C++ templates are turing complete iirc
02:31:16  <Raynos>something should be build
02:31:58  <chrisdickinson>+1
02:34:01  <Raynos>well first I need to finish my webrtc emulation and a js database
02:34:29  * chrisdickinsonnods
02:34:58  <Raynos>then I can go back to UI based stuff
02:35:14  <Raynos>UI stuff is hard when there is no place to put data
02:35:33  <chrisdickinson>i'm kind of hoping the webaudio createMediaStreamDestination stuff lands so i can build a modem on top of it
02:36:03  <chrisdickinson>just for the delicious irony
02:37:32  <Raynos>why do you need that?
02:37:54  <chrisdickinson>for no reason, really.
02:38:11  <chrisdickinson>i'm excited for the ability to do p2p streams between browsers though, whether through datachannel or the audio api.
02:39:18  <chrisdickinson>it's just bonus points if i can make it sound like an old time-y modem while that happens.
02:42:57  <Raynos>yes
02:43:01  <Raynos>BONUS POINTS
02:43:01  <LOUDBOT>NO. I HATE THEM THEN. THAT IS JUST THEM BEING STUPID IDIOTS SCREWING UP AND THEY DESERVE IT.
02:43:15  <Raynos>does createMediaStreamDestination require PeerConnection
02:44:32  <chrisdickinson>no, i think it's all the webaudio context api
02:45:24  <chrisdickinson>but basically it lets you modify the bits on the way out -- so if you combine it with webrtc, you can encode data as audio, send it, and (if i'm not mistaken) decode it at the other end
02:45:49  <chrisdickinson>which would be an okay-ish shim until datachannel lands in earnest
02:51:06  <chrisdickinson>is there a way that i could require a plain text file in browserify?
02:51:18  <chrisdickinson>or otherwise make it part of the bundle?
02:52:30  <Raynos>yes
02:52:34  <Raynos>browserify-server --bundle
02:52:44  <Raynos>https://github.com/Raynos/browserify-server/blob/master/index.js#L22
02:57:05  <chrisdickinson>well, to publish it as a reusable module -- though this might've come up here previously
03:00:24  <Raynos>it has :P
03:00:34  <Raynos>https://github.com/substack/exportify
03:03:33  <chrisdickinson>aaah
03:03:34  <chrisdickinson>thanks!
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04:27:07  <Raynos>Call all streamheads
04:27:14  <Raynos>why does through.write return !this.paused
04:28:01  <ik>that would nominally be 'whether on not that thing got wrote'
04:34:46  <mbalho>brianloveswords: do you know where i can find more info on that mozilla japan cocktail robot from mozfest?
04:35:10  <mbalho>brianloveswords: specifically the parts list
04:35:53  <fotoverite>Back in NYC
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05:08:41  <st_luke_>w00t upstate NY
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05:36:39  <fotoverite>Why you upstate luke?
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06:16:27  <Raynos>substack: https://github.com/substack/shoe/pull/10
06:16:41  <Raynos>I've moved your complexity into npm
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07:11:12  <Raynos>https://github.com/Raynos/streams2#example
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08:35:19  <Raynos>hells yes!
08:35:28  <Raynos>Working peer connection emulation demo
08:41:42  <Raynos>https://github.com/Raynos/peer-connection-shim#example
08:46:04  <juliangruber>Raynos: https://gist.github.com/d0cdfd9160a21b78a4ee https://gist.github.com/dba5bc1113c5f6bc23ae
08:46:28  <Raynos>juliangruber: implemented or API ideas?
08:46:41  <juliangruber>api ideas^^
08:47:18  <Raynos>I think join / leave is not the most optimum api
08:47:25  <Raynos>well maybe it is to be honest
08:47:35  <Raynos>I do like the documented open connections
08:47:50  <Raynos>it will probably need an API to say "I am connected to X"
08:47:58  <Raynos>it will probably also need an API to say "my id is Y"
08:48:04  <Raynos>it also needs the ability to set meta data
08:48:06  <Raynos>like header-stream
08:48:23  <Raynos>id: n, connections: [ids....], meta: { ... }
08:48:34  <Raynos>as for vector clock I dont know
08:48:46  <Raynos>juliangruber: https://github.com/nko3/foojs/tree/master/vectorclock
08:49:52  <juliangruber>Raynos: the vector clock lib looks like one implemented in Go I've found. The question is if you need that kind of information of if what I provide is enough
08:50:13  <Raynos>i dont really care
08:50:16  <Raynos>all I care about is comparing
08:50:18  <Raynos>one to another
08:50:24  <Raynos>and knowing that they are incrementing
08:50:44  <Raynos>I just want a monotonic-timestamp that is reliable in a distributed system
08:50:59  <juliangruber>wouldn't .on('update', cb) do that for you?
08:51:03  <Raynos>ideally the vectorclock has a custom .valueOf() that returns a number or string
08:51:05  <Raynos>for local comparison
08:51:21  <Raynos>so I can do
08:51:24  <Raynos>ts1 < ts2
08:51:25  <Raynos>and shit works
08:55:42  <Raynos>http://raynos.github.com/peer-connection-shim/example/simple/static/left.html
08:58:56  <juliangruber>Raynos: https://gist.github.com/dba5bc1113c5f6bc23ae added meta stuff
09:00:15  <Raynos>juliangruber: seems reasonable
09:03:19  <juliangruber>Raynos: not sure I get yet what you want with the vector clocks. can you post a minimal example showing just that?
09:06:01  <Raynos>juliangruber: I know what I want to consume as an end user
09:06:06  <Raynos>not sure how to implement the vector clocks
09:06:10  <Raynos>there are two apis
09:06:20  <Raynos>one that scuttlebutt will use to make the vector clock work
09:06:30  <juliangruber>wouldn't my api with clockA.compare(clockB) work?
09:06:31  <Raynos>and one that users of scuttlebutt will use to interact with vector clock timestamps
09:06:34  <Raynos>the latter should be dead simple
09:06:42  <Raynos>clockA < clockB is nicer
09:06:51  <juliangruber>can't overload
09:06:56  <Raynos>you can implement < & > for arbitary objects by implementing .valueOf()
09:06:56  <juliangruber>so how?
09:07:01  <Raynos>sec
09:08:09  <Raynos>juliangruber: http://jsfiddle.net/XhKE2/1/
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09:38:25  <juliangruber>Raynos: cool, didn't know that
09:38:31  <juliangruber>is it cross browser?
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09:47:54  <Raynos>juliangruber: yes
09:48:03  <Raynos>valueOf is a thing in the es5 spec
09:48:08  <Raynos>what your looking at is a hack
09:48:21  <Raynos>because es5 spec says when < then call .valueOf on both operands and compare that
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10:11:04  <juliangruber>nice
10:11:57  <juliangruber>Raynos: when you distribute clocks how would you access clocks?
10:12:17  <Raynos>each scuttlebutt or stream has a clock
10:12:29  <Raynos>each time that stream applies a new update the clock gets updated locally
10:12:45  <Raynos>when new changes come down the stream from other scuttlebutts they will contain changed clocks
10:12:51  <Raynos>which will be merged into my local clock
10:13:08  <juliangruber>clock.on('update', cb) does that automatically
10:13:25  <juliangruber>and in clock.on('conflict', cb) you can resolve conflicts
10:13:31  <Raynos>but from my point of view a vector clock is something scuttlebutt would use at the implementation level
10:13:40  <Raynos>I would use scuttlebutt and expect that ts1 < ts2 works
10:13:45  <Raynos>and if needed
10:13:56  <Raynos>I can do ts1.compare(ts2) or ts1.clockMethod(...)
10:15:01  <juliangruber>dominictarr, we're kind of stuck... https://gist.github.com/d0cdfd9160a21b78a4ee how would the clock api need to look like?
10:15:50  <Raynos>well all I really need from clock
10:15:55  <Raynos>is a way to say
10:16:00  <Raynos>clock.merge(otherClock)
10:16:05  <Raynos>and clock.increment()
10:16:10  <Raynos>also a clock.toJSON()
10:16:16  <juliangruber>how would you get otherClock
10:16:18  <Raynos>and the comparison should work
10:16:27  <Raynos>over the network
10:16:31  <Raynos>as json
10:16:50  <Raynos>stream.on("data", function (update) { clock.merge(update[2]) })
10:17:03  <Raynos>where update is [key, value, clock, source]
10:17:29  <Raynos>the only issue is
10:17:49  <Raynos>is { uid: 2, uid2: 1 } < { uid: 1, uid2: 2 }
10:18:16  <Raynos>probably break ties determinstically based on key order
10:18:22  <Raynos>in that case uid2 would win
10:18:31  <Raynos>because uid2 > uid
10:18:41  <juliangruber>Raynos: ah yeah makes sense to implement a basic vectorclock first before thinking about distribution
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10:19:09  <Raynos>https://github.com/nko3/foojs/blob/master/vectorclock/vector_clock.js#L4
10:19:11  <Raynos>thats increment
10:19:31  <Raynos>https://github.com/nko3/foojs/blob/master/vectorclock/vector_clock.js#L31
10:19:32  <Raynos>comparison
10:19:48  <Raynos>https://github.com/nko3/foojs/blob/master/vectorclock/vector_clock.js#L58
10:19:53  <Raynos>isConcurrant is kind of cool
10:20:15  <juliangruber>Raynos: why don't you use that lib then?
10:20:17  <Raynos>https://github.com/nko3/foojs/blob/master/vectorclock/vector_clock.js#L80
10:20:19  <Raynos>and that is merge
10:20:26  <Raynos>well having actually read his code
10:20:29  <Raynos>I think I should :P
10:20:39  <juliangruber>yeah
10:20:51  <juliangruber>and I could use that to do the synchronized clock
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16:51:03  <AvianFlu>YOU HEAR THAT LOUDBOT? CHINESE COFFEE!
16:51:03  <LOUDBOT>FIND THEN BE THAT WAY
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18:09:51  <CoverSlide|TPFR>SASHIMI TO GOHAN BITCHES
18:09:52  <LOUDBOT>I DON'T THINK I MADE DRD1812 CASE-INSENSITIVE
18:11:33  <AvianFlu>I'M GONNA MAKE YOU INTO LOUDBOT SASHIMI HERE IN A MINUTE
18:11:33  <LOUDBOT>GOOD FOLKS, THE DAY HAS CHANGED. REJOICE AT THE TURNING OF THE NIGHT, AT THE COMMING OF THE SUNRISE, AT THE CHANCE TO RIGHT YESTERDAY'S WRONGS AND FULFILL YOUR DESTINY!
18:11:53  <AvianFlu>WAIT WAS THAT SOMETHING OPTIMISTIC FROM LOUDBOT I THINK THAT MEANS THE WORLD IS GONNA END
18:11:54  <LOUDBOT>THAT'S RIGHT ASCCI. AMERICAN STANDARD CODE OF CRAPPY INFORMATION.
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22:19:06  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 8, free: 50]
22:19:36  <CoverSlide|TPFR>wow 8 developers. that's the highest I've seen it
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23:12:59  <substack>st_luke, defunctzombie: you folks should join brianloveswords in #nerdtracker to organize some east coast chaos and hacking at cafes
23:13:21  <fotoverite>I'm all for this!
23:13:35  <substack>oh right fotoverite too!
23:13:46  <brianloveswords>East Coast, unite!
23:14:03  <defunctzombie>\o/
23:19:06  <rowbit>Hourly usage stats: [developer: 2, free: 48]
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23:27:37  <fotoverite>\o
23:27:58  <fotoverite>How is tehwizzards doign?
23:29:05  <substack>still works
23:29:53  <fotoverite>That something
23:30:14  <fotoverite>I kinda am in loved with the lofiness of sara chipps entry.
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