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01:39:19  <Raynos>substack: Thanks for http-duplex !
01:43:54  <substack>no probs!
01:44:03  <substack>didn't think people would actually be using that one
01:44:40  <Raynos>substack: https://gist.github.com/3805596#example
01:44:51  <Raynos>you need to turn req/res into a single thing
01:44:59  <Raynos>if you want to turn a http server into a stream of single things
01:45:22  <Raynos>EVERYTHING IS A STREAM
01:45:23  <LOUDBOT>I AM A PIRATE. NOW BEND OVER AND LET ME WALK MY PLANK
01:48:39  <AvianFlu>DON'T WALK YOUR PLANK IN PUBLIC
01:48:40  <LOUDBOT>TOOTHPCK LEG IS ALL STRIKING AND SHIT AND MUFFINTOP IS BLEEDING ALL TO FUCK WHAT A MESS. WHO DOES THIS SHIT WTF?!!
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10:01:19  <Raynos>isaacs: https://github.com/Benvie/WeakMap
10:01:27  <Raynos>Non-compiled weakmap for ES5
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10:34:02  <dominictarr>substack, hey whats up?
10:34:17  <dominictarr>assume everyone is in a cafe somewheres?
10:35:11  <mbalho>dominictarr: https://t.co/MwMGzmIC
10:35:40  <dominictarr>mbalho, SWEET SEE YOU THERE
10:36:09  <mbalho>dominictarr: im actually goin to berlin right now
10:36:19  <dominictarr>oh, already?
10:36:48  <mbalho>yea ive neve rbeen
10:36:52  <dominictarr>mbalho, see you in berlin in a few days!
10:36:54  <mbalho>so i wanted to spend lotsa time there
10:37:02  <dominictarr>I'm arriving on the 3rd.
10:44:09  <dominictarr>mbalho, go to the flea market and buy cheap bicycles.
10:44:30  <dominictarr>hmm, it might be closed by the time you arrive.
10:44:51  <mbalho>dominictarr: ahh yea i get in at like 6
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11:18:59  <substack>wifi on the beach!
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11:25:00  <substack>ok dumping off my stuff and then heading to the cafe!
12:06:01  <substack>at the oasis hostel
12:06:28  <substack>totes left my nema 5-15 to europlug power adapter at the last place >_<
12:13:00  <substack>german rock/hip hop music playing
12:13:42  <substack>had a falafel wrap with ketchup in it wandering around earlier
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14:31:08  <AvianFlu>I'LL STATUS YOUR HOURLY USAGE
14:31:09  <LOUDBOT>WHY DOES THE APPLE LOGO LOOK LIKE A MAN POOPING
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19:31:59  <mike-d>Raynos: did you see substacks LXJS presentation?
19:32:09  <Raynos>yes
19:32:11  <Raynos>just watched it
19:32:16  <Raynos>its pretty cool
19:33:26  <mike-d>made me want to take another crack at VI, yea he did an awesome job, especially running through the files
19:34:18  <mike-d>Mikeal had a good one, pretty funny
19:36:05  <mike-d>i'm experimenting with an http router that uses pipe()
19:37:33  <Raynos>mike-d: http-stream, route-filter
19:40:28  <mike-d>Raynos: will check em out, i'm doing HostStream, PathStream, VerbStream, where host['site.com'] is a valve that points to a path etc...
19:40:42  <Raynos>open source
19:40:44  <Raynos>github links!
19:40:57  <Raynos>https://github.com/Raynos/http-stream#example
19:42:53  <mike-d>haha… nice bro!!!
19:44:56  <Raynos>If your going to write streams
19:45:01  <Raynos>put them on github
19:47:11  <Raynos>npm search stream | grep raynos | wc -l === 40
19:47:15  <Raynos>I write too many streams
19:48:01  <mike-d>I will for sure, doing something called plumber (similar to your chain) that pipes streams based on an array syntax [ stream, [ stream, stream, [ stream, stream ] ] ]
19:50:44  <mike-d>I also started thinking about using streams for templating, only issue is partials
19:54:30  <Raynos>https://github.com/Raynos/cascadiajs.github.com/blob/master/proposal/stream-all-things_raynos.md
19:54:41  <Raynos>Someone give feedback on how my proposal sounds boring / sucks / etc
19:54:58  <Raynos>mike-d: streams for templating is totally possible.
19:55:06  <Raynos>its just have to write a streaming template library
19:55:10  <Raynos>and thats non trivial
19:57:17  <mike-d>for partials I was thinking about <div id=content> …render partial in stream … BUT how to return the stream to the outer template to render the closing </div>
19:59:48  <Raynos>just have a tree of streams
19:59:49  <Raynos>and flatten it
20:00:18  <mike-d>one possibility, split the template into two streams enter/leave, another is to have the parent stream on('end') to the last child but that kinda smells
20:00:37  <Raynos>the way it works in my mind
20:00:41  <Raynos>is that a template is just a map
20:00:44  <Raynos>there is a stream of data
20:00:47  <Raynos>you map it to HTML
20:01:39  <mike-d>exactly, same here, just transforming data
20:02:29  <mike-d>love your proposal about streams everywhere
20:03:32  <mike-d>what do you think about a ValveStream that looks up the next stream in the pipe using a simple hashtable?
20:04:21  <Raynos>mike-d: https://gist.github.com/3805596
20:04:25  <Raynos>use gists to communicate ideas
20:04:31  <Raynos>implementation details are optional
20:15:30  <mike-d>Raynos: https://gist.github.com/3808326
20:17:01  <Raynos>I dont write code like that
20:17:08  <Raynos>a very unnatural example
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20:22:10  <substack>woot
20:24:47  <Raynos>substack: Any advice on polishing my proposal ? ( https://github.com/Raynos/cascadiajs.github.com/blob/master/proposal/stream-all-things_raynos.md )
20:26:09  <mike-d>substack: awesome presentation!
20:26:16  <substack>Raynos: seems pretty good
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21:28:53  <Raynos>https://gist.github.com/3808490
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21:54:42  <dominictarr>substack, YOU THERE?
21:56:34  <Raynos>dominictarr: did you see https://gist.github.com/3808490 ?
21:56:51  <dominictarr>Raynos, been offline all day
21:58:34  <Raynos>its an interesting take on middleware
21:58:47  <Raynos>middleware is just a lazy mapping applied to your stream of requests
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22:00:53  <dominictarr>LOL http://static.neatorama.com/images/2008-12/mad-scientist-mad-engineers.jpg
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22:27:54  <Raynos>isaacs: Readable streams havn't become easier to write
22:28:01  <Raynos>Now the pain point is not pause / resume logic
22:28:06  <Raynos>its low / high water marks
22:28:22  <Raynos>I have written a ton of readable streams recently they all have no buffer cap
22:28:42  <Raynos>its an easy trap not to handle backpressure correctly in your custom streams
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22:46:34  <mike-d>Raynos: if all streams in the pipeline are synchronous can you still get hit by backpressure or is it just for streams in the pipeline that perform an async operation?
22:55:36  <isaacs>Raynos: you're talking about streams that send buffers and strings, or custom objects?
22:55:55  <isaacs>Raynos: you don't actually have to set those low/high marks.
22:56:00  <isaacs>Raynos: they're all handled internally to the class.
22:56:41  <isaacs>Raynos: also, that talk... that's basically what i'm going to be discussing at JSConf AU
22:57:24  <isaacs>Sſ Conf
22:59:06  <isaacs>ɟuoↃSſ
22:59:14  <isaacs>ohh, unicode irssi fail :)
22:59:34  <dominictarr>isaacs, Raynos which talk?
22:59:51  <isaacs>dominictarr: New Streams: Why, How, and What you shoudl do about them
23:00:06  <dominictarr>isaacs, ah, cool.
23:00:22  <dominictarr>isaacs, what are you speaking on at nodedublin?
23:01:05  <isaacs>dominictarr: post structuralism in module systems
23:01:21  <dominictarr>VERY GOOD
23:01:22  <LOUDBOT>BUT YOU JUST KEEP DOING IT
23:01:33  <isaacs>how npm is both a Serious Host for Serious Business, and a theater of the absurd, and why this is a necessary and valuable shift in human society
23:01:47  <dominictarr>VERY GOOD
23:01:47  <LOUDBOT>INDIFFERENCE IS THE CATALYST WHICH ENABLES THE QUICKNESS. TO THE REAR OF YOUR THOUGHTS LIES A CONSTERNATION. IT IS SOVERIGN. ASSOCIATE IT TO YOUR TRANSITIVITY; BEGIN FROM THE BEGINNING. SYNCHRONICITY IS NOT YOUR DOING: IT IS THE FINAL POINT OF THE ORDERED TRIPLET WHO ENGULFED YOUR CACTUS. LEGENDARY.
23:02:18  <dominictarr>LOUDBOT, whosaid
23:02:19  <LOUDBOT>dominictarr: ik in ##church-of-loudbot on freenode
23:15:07  <Raynos>isaacs: any stream. But my readable streams overwrite read
23:15:24  <Raynos>isaacs: you only get those features if you use _read and _read is tied to "streams are buffers or strings"
23:15:52  <Raynos>dominictarr: https://github.com/cascadiajs/cascadiajs.github.com/blob/master/proposal/stream-all-things_raynos.md
23:16:20  <Raynos>isaacs: my talk will be heavily focused on cosmetic streams.
23:17:27  <dominictarr>Raynos, there was a talk that mentioned using pipeline based UI as being a known pattern.
23:17:40  <dominictarr>talk was on alternatives to MVC
23:17:41  <Raynos>dominictarr: the MVC talk?
23:18:13  <Raynos>mike-d: back pressure
23:18:23  <Raynos>dominictarr: watched that this morning
23:19:13  <dominictarr>garann's talk
23:19:16  <Raynos>isaacs: does JSConf AU fly speakers over
23:19:21  <mike-d>mvc talk had a mention of evented UI at the end, but not streams as I recall
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23:20:02  <dominictarr>mike-d, they didn't use streams per-se but it was the same idea.
23:20:24  <dominictarr>just a different implementation of the "true" abstraction.
23:21:16  <dominictarr>Raynos, substack matthew bergman gave me a crazy idea that is totally doable.
23:21:33  <Raynos>dominictarr: go
23:22:03  <dominictarr>use scuttlebutt, crdt, etc, to make a hackedy like thing so that kids can make toy apps.
23:22:31  <dominictarr>so, get kids to make distributed apps!
23:23:01  <Raynos>Interesting
23:23:14  <Raynos>you can totally do that
23:23:26  <dominictarr>yeah, I totally belive we can make it that easy
23:25:18  <Raynos>dominictarr: https://gist.github.com/3808721
23:25:22  <Raynos>where save & get interact with crdt
23:25:32  <mike-d>this reminds me of the msft robot thing
23:25:35  <Raynos>and click & insert are dom events and dom insertion respectively
23:25:51  <dominictarr>Raynos, fuck yeah.
23:26:11  <Raynos>then just hook up crdt over discovery network
23:26:34  <Raynos>the hardest part is that kids will have to npm install
23:26:38  <Raynos>but that can be removed
23:26:46  <Raynos>by having a kids.js file that gives you a crazy framework
23:27:00  <Raynos>then they just drop it into an index.html and run it locally
23:27:01  <dominictarr>you would include all the basic stuff in a bundle.
23:27:29  <Raynos>https://gist.github.com/3808721#L1
23:27:31  <mike-d>or just tool it, and give it a touch interface
23:27:43  <Raynos>Have a connect call that hooks up to discovery network
23:27:44  <dominictarr>mike-d, that too!
23:27:58  <Raynos>mike-d: that's harder then writing the framework :P
23:28:01  <mike-d>and then let them peek under the hood
23:28:12  <Raynos>you have to like create UIs :D
23:28:12  <mike-d>LOL tooling always is
23:28:19  <Raynos>mike-d, dominictarr: http://worrydream.com/LearnableProgramming/
23:30:02  <mike-d>Raynos: "create UIs" LMAO totally right!
23:30:45  <mike-d>kids playing with node is cool, let them at the cloud, even cooler!
23:32:30  <Raynos>mike-d: have you seen discovery network?
23:32:48  <mike-d>RE: 100% evented UI, I have done this is C and it's awesome, but you still need to create and wire the initial UI, streams or some derivation may be cool for that...
23:33:04  <mike-d>Raynos: I don't watch much TV
23:34:43  <Raynos>mike-d: https://github.com/Raynos/discovery-network
23:35:20  <Raynos>mike-d: https://github.com/Raynos/stream-chat#the-server-is-a-static-file-server
23:37:01  <mike-d>smacks head! you were talking about a node module!
23:37:26  <dominictarr>I'm going to bed. we'll talk more about this tomorrow though!
23:37:38  * dominictarrchanged nick to dominic_ZZZZ
23:38:43  <Raynos>dominictarr, substack: nodeknockout idea === "Let kids make distributed streaming node apps"
23:43:15  <mike-d>Raynos: I was working on templating with streams the last couple hours, trying to resist the urge to add some sort of continuation since streams serial, any thoughts on that?
23:45:20  <Raynos>streams are not serial
23:45:44  <Raynos>mike-d: https://github.com/Raynos/proxy-stream#example
23:45:51  <Raynos>The best part of streams is that they are asynchronous
23:46:01  <Raynos>proxy-stream shows the notion of a transformation callback
23:46:08  <Raynos>which is the basis for any transformation / through stream
23:53:29  <mike-d>Raynos: I was exploring doing it without next / cb, in in other words could could the semantics be applied to a stream in a way that made since for a child branch of streams ( hope that makes since, and it's just thinking out loud )
23:55:21  <Raynos>mike-d: asynchronous things exist