00:00:17  * _jon_quit (Quit: _jon_)
00:09:11  * graeme_fquit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
00:11:06  * pmuellrquit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/)
00:19:44  <ccowan>fivetanley: Think if you are going to be a professional developer you could probably get away with it but you going to have to work really hard to fight the people who thing a CS degree is a requirement.
00:19:57  <ccowan>*think
00:22:00  * ramitosjoined
00:22:30  <ccowan>fivetanley: I have a BS in a different field and I've always been self-concious about not having a CS degree (which has pushed me to really work hard to learn as much as I can about this craft). Anyone can go and earn a CS degree, but it's really hard to earn passion.
00:22:55  <fivetanley>yeah, I am actually thinking about switching my major to english
00:23:07  <fivetanley>i learn more about programming in my spare time than i do at school
00:23:33  * EhevuTovquit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
00:23:38  <ccowan>One of the best developers I worked with (at Yahoo) didn't even have a high school diploma
00:24:01  <ccowan>He coded circles around guys form Berkley and Stanford
00:24:09  <ccowan>completely self taught
00:24:33  <fivetanley>exactly
00:24:52  <fivetanley>i don't think academia is doing a great job of teaching people like myself, but that's just my opinion
00:24:58  <fivetanley>class sucks all the fun out of programming for me
00:25:07  <ccowan>I can say this... having a degree in our industry is not a requirement (even when it says it is)
00:25:51  <fivetanley>I have learned that just this past couple of weeks.
00:26:05  <fivetanley>I'm looking to get out of my retail job and into programming so I've been networking with our local users groups
00:26:36  <fivetanley>I got one job interview ( wasn't at the level they needed, but the interview counts ) based solely on the fact that one guy liked me and recommended me to his boss, and his boss liked my cover letter
00:26:51  <fivetanley>Cover letters seem to go a long way compared to shotgunning resumes.
00:27:06  <fivetanley>I almost always try to find somebody who works at the company instead of using the craigslist/whatever email
00:27:07  <ccowan>that's the way to do it... I would love it if our industry took on the apprentace system like carpenters or other trades.
00:28:07  <ccowan>I've seen guys with masters degrees and phd who could barely write a simple web app or even a library from scratch
00:28:19  <fivetanley>Well our users group is putting on a Learn Rails group twice a week, so I'm being mentored that way. I also signed up with RailsMentors.com or something and got paired with one of the guys in the local users' group. We've both been busy but I can't wait to start. I also pair with people when I can.
00:28:20  <ccowan>they had to copy everything from someone else's code
00:28:43  <ccowan>Node should do that
00:28:54  <fivetanley>they should
00:29:10  <ccowan>I would totally spend an evening once a week with someone who really wants to learn
00:29:14  <fivetanley>the last company i interviewed at was full stack javascript (including node), but they weren't looking for someone entry level
00:29:26  <fivetanley>they did like me though and told me to apply again later after i built some more things
00:30:26  <ccowan>we are moving from PHP to Node.js
00:30:39  <ccowan>I just got done re-rewriting a major portion of our site.
00:30:45  <fivetanley>That's awesome.
00:30:52  <ccowan>It's just easier to be in one language
00:31:00  <fivetanley>We used a pretty early version of PHP5 (like .0 ) in my "web development" class
00:31:09  <ccowan>yeah
00:31:09  <fivetanley>PHP is so frustrating with its inconsistent error handling
00:31:16  <ccowan>yup
00:31:28  <ccowan>I've been writing PHP since 4.0
00:31:31  <ccowan>it's horrible
00:31:41  <ccowan>Wiat... I started on 3.4
00:31:42  <ccowan>haha
00:31:44  <fivetanley>I mean node has its own issues with debugging, but we seem to have some conventions ( like error is the first param in the callback )
00:31:46  <ccowan>god I'm old
00:31:48  <fivetanley>oh god ew
00:31:51  <fivetanley>i'm so sorry for you
00:32:10  <ccowan>My first resume was in flash in 1997
00:32:13  * cjmquit (Quit: Leaving)
00:32:19  <ccowan>landed me a sweet gig
00:32:34  <fivetanley>man, flash was pretty fancy back then
00:32:38  <fivetanley>we didn't even have the internet back then
00:32:39  <ccowan>totally
00:32:53  <fivetanley>we had a computer with windows 95, and one of those ghetto printers that has reams on the side
00:33:03  <ccowan>ha!
00:33:09  <ccowan>I wan on a Mac
00:33:14  <ccowan>*was
00:33:29  <ccowan>OS8
00:33:29  <fivetanley>My elementary school had Macs, I thought they were pretty sweet
00:33:35  <fivetanley>Played me some good ol' oregon trail on 'em
00:33:39  <ccowan>yup
00:33:44  <fivetanley>I always got my keyboarding stuff done early
00:33:52  <fivetanley>so I usually spent all of keyboarding class playing oregon trail
00:33:52  <fivetanley>haha
00:33:54  <ccowan>Ah the good old days...
00:34:50  <ccowan>I just bought a mechanical keyboard that feel just like the old Apple Keyboard II that came on the Quadras we had in college my first year
00:35:19  <fivetanley>Nice
00:35:23  <ccowan>Although those are Alpes switches and these are Cherry MX Blues (but I digress)
00:35:26  <fivetanley>I really prefer the chiclets just because they're quiet
00:35:52  <fivetanley>I can't usually listen to music to drown it out without getting distracted
00:35:53  <ccowan>yeah... I Like the noise... it's deeply satisfying to me when I hacking away in VIM
00:36:00  <fivetanley>yay, another vim user
00:36:13  <ccowan>Oh... I have VIM totally tricked out
00:36:33  <fivetanley>I have some stuff, but nothing too special.
00:36:41  <fivetanley>I think the fanciest thing I have is UltiSnips.
00:36:48  <ccowan>Checkout vim-powerline
00:37:00  <ccowan>it's my new favorite
00:37:07  <ccowan>I also use tmux
00:37:47  <ccowan>SO I have 3 columns below VIM that have IRC, and node logs... then above I have VIM with 6 splits (3 cols x 2 row)
00:38:25  <ccowan>on my 27" display... I think I'm might have to get another 27" display :D
00:39:16  <ccowan>We are also using CoffeeScript (which seems to make most JavaScript purists vomit in their mouths)
00:39:19  <fivetanley>oh yeah i've got powerline too
00:39:20  <fivetanley>it's so rad
00:39:28  <ccowan>Have you seen powerline for tmux
00:39:42  <fivetanley>There's a different powerline, specifically for tmux?
00:39:49  <ccowan>yi[
00:39:51  <ccowan>yup
00:39:54  <fivetanley>then i haven't seen it
00:40:09  <ccowan>https://github.com/erikw/tmux-powerline
00:40:15  <fivetanley>I've heard tmux is cool, but I haven't gotten around to learning it yet
00:40:32  <ccowan>I can't survive without tmux
00:41:12  <fivetanley>oh bah, i'm gonna have to recompile bash for this :|
00:41:16  <fivetanley>damn you apple
00:41:21  <ccowan>brew install bash
00:41:22  <ccowan>:D
00:41:32  <fivetanley>Oh, I use zsh so apparently i don't need to
00:41:47  <ccowan>yeah... I'm using that too
00:41:59  <ccowan>ok... time for me to go eat dinner with the wife and kids
00:42:01  <fivetanley>i haven't learned to use its potential yet
00:42:02  <ccowan>take it easy
00:42:02  <fivetanley>see ya
00:42:05  <fivetanley>you too mang
00:42:16  * ccowanchanged nick to ccowan_away
00:45:25  * dguttmanjoined
00:58:07  * forceblastquit (Quit: forceblast)
01:07:40  * dguttmanquit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
01:37:32  * forceblastjoined
01:55:58  * cjmjoined
02:17:36  * shykeschanged nick to zz_shykes
02:21:55  * ramitosquit
02:35:36  * ramitosjoined
02:41:19  * MartinCleaverquit (Quit: MartinCleaver)
03:44:02  * dshaw_quit (Quit: Leaving.)
04:35:30  * ramitosquit
04:41:29  * forceblastquit (Quit: forceblast)
05:26:38  * theColejoined
07:15:22  * zz_shykeschanged nick to shykes
07:33:36  * _jon_joined
08:13:17  * graeme_fjoined
08:15:33  * shykeschanged nick to zz_shykes
08:28:23  * `3rdEdenjoined
08:33:38  * dshaw_joined
09:25:27  * zz_shykeschanged nick to shykes
09:30:16  * shykeschanged nick to zz_shykes
10:04:49  * SubStack_joined
10:07:15  * graeme_fquit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
10:09:21  * SubStackquit (Disconnected by services)
10:09:23  * SubStack_changed nick to substack
10:19:56  * dshaw_quit (Quit: Leaving.)
10:26:21  * `3rdEdenquit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
10:57:49  * _jon_quit (Quit: _jon_)
11:05:06  * `3rdEdenjoined
11:37:24  * `3rdEdenquit (Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com)
12:00:07  * hillerstorm_phonquit (Remote host closed the connection)
12:00:20  * AndreasMadsenjoined
12:05:41  * hillerstorm_phonjoined
12:33:06  * theColequit (Quit: theCole)
13:10:45  * AndreasMadsenquit (Remote host closed the connection)
13:49:18  * gorbizquit (Quit: gorbiz)
13:53:30  * gorbizjoined
14:17:25  * MartinCleaverjoined
14:17:25  * MartinCleaverquit (Changing host)
14:17:25  * MartinCleaverjoined
14:27:42  * _jon_joined
15:04:50  * forceblastjoined
15:47:37  * Topcatjoined
15:49:38  * Topcatpart
16:07:15  * graeme_fjoined
16:11:20  * cjmtopic: http://youtu.be/1G7Eh1AS9fM
16:36:02  * dshaw_joined
17:06:18  * theColejoined
17:17:17  * theColequit (Quit: theCole)
21:33:33  * cjmtopic: http://youtu.be/1G7Eh1AS9fM
21:56:42  * dshaw_joined
22:16:44  * cjmquit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
22:20:12  * graeme_fquit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
23:17:03  * forceblastjoined
23:28:38  * dshaw_quit (Quit: Leaving.)