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00:08:11  <bnoordhuis>man, i forgot how many great mtv unplugged sessions were recorded in the 90s
00:08:27  <bnoordhuis>who knew bryan adams could sound so great?
00:13:23  <indutny>:)
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00:18:33  <bnoordhuis>indutny: still up?
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00:24:02  <indutny>bnoordhuis: yes
00:24:09  <indutny>bnoordhuis: reading papers, you know
00:24:30  <indutny>bnoordhuis: what's up?
00:24:38  <tjfontaine>http://llvm.org/devmtg/2012-11/Gregor-Modules.pdf?=submit
00:24:54  <indutny>I already read it
00:25:06  <tjfontaine>was it on HN or similar?
00:25:26  <bnoordhuis>indutny: just curious. it must be close to 4 am in your part of the world
00:25:32  <indutny>bnoordhuis: yes, it is
00:25:36  <indutny>I've an idea and can't sleep
00:26:20  <indutny>ok, time to sleep now
00:26:23  <indutny>bnoordhuis: see ya tomorrow
00:26:33  <bnoordhuis>sleep tight fedor :)
00:26:35  <indutny>tjfontaine: and you too
00:26:36  <indutny>:)
00:26:40  <indutny>bnoordhuis: well, yeah you too man
00:26:49  <tjfontaine>indeed
00:26:49  <bnoordhuis>it's only 1.30 am here
00:26:52  <CoverSlide>wow, he's almost describing the D language
00:27:11  <tjfontaine>to a point
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00:32:20  <isaacs>mraleph1: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3685/presentations/streams2/streams2-ko.pdf
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00:36:53  <TooTallNate>isaacs: what does >> mean in your notes?
00:39:47  <CoverSlide>append
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00:54:07  <isaacs>TooTallNate: oh, the >> is "change slide here"
00:54:27  <isaacs>TooTallNate: it's there so that i know what i'm about to start saying, and don't have a choppy transition
00:54:42  <TooTallNate>nice
00:55:11  <TooTallNate>© Izs' Pro Speaking tops
00:55:12  <TooTallNate>tips
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02:12:03  <MI6>joyent/node: Ryunosuke SATO v0.8 * 8316145 : doc: Fix missing link target to 'https.request()' - http://git.io/qljz_g
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02:21:31  <MI6>joyent/node: isaacs created branch streams2-net-perf-wip - http://git.io/-vSRcQ
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10:32:28  <indutny>ryah: yt?
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11:51:36  <indutny>isaacs: nice! :)
11:51:41  <indutny>isaacs: very motivating
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12:41:28  <txdv_>hello
12:41:36  <txdv_>I have found the UV_IPV6ONLY flag
12:41:49  <txdv_>and I wondered why do we need it at all
12:42:08  <txdv_>if I bind a udp socket to a ipv6 address, it will be automatically ipv6only?
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14:17:43  <indutny>yes
14:17:56  <indutny>well, what do you mean exactly?
14:18:11  <indutny>you can't use same socket for ipv6 and ipv4
14:21:17  <txdv_>yes you can
14:21:29  <piscisaureus_>it's platform dependant
14:21:35  <txdv_>so only on windows?
14:21:37  <piscisaureus_>for udp actually it's configurable
14:21:52  <piscisaureus_>almost all platforms support dualstack sockets
14:22:07  <piscisaureus_>but on windows it's default-off and on linux and mac it's default-on
14:22:13  <txdv_>woot
14:22:39  <piscisaureus_>but it only happens when you bind to INADDR_ANY
14:22:43  <piscisaureus_>and create an IPv6 socket
14:22:50  <txdv_>ok wait
14:22:58  <txdv_>it is default off on windows?
14:23:01  <piscisaureus_>yes
14:23:09  <piscisaureus_>it is possible to turn it on
14:23:15  <piscisaureus_>but libuv has no hook for it atm
14:23:25  <indutny>aah
14:23:28  <txdv_>ok
14:23:32  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb513665(v=vs.85).aspx
14:23:32  <indutny>ooooh
14:23:38  <indutny>dualstack
14:23:53  <indutny>but you won't be able to listen on two different addresses, right?
14:23:56  <txdv_>so i can't turn on dualstack on windows using libuv
14:24:04  <piscisaureus_>not atm
14:24:08  <piscisaureus_>but if you really need it we can do that
14:24:22  <piscisaureus_>indutny: txdv_: true, it only works if you listen on all interfaces
14:24:31  <indutny>useful too, though
14:24:39  <txdv_>i don't need it
14:24:52  <txdv_>I just want to make the behaviour of my apis consistent
14:24:57  <piscisaureus_>it's really simple to add, but nobody has really cared so far :-)
14:25:13  <txdv_>so since it is default on on unixes, i will pass IPV6Only if i bind to ipv6 addresses
14:25:28  <txdv_>or no
14:25:31  <txdv_>that doesn't make sense
14:25:46  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: well you have to *disable* IPV6ONLY
14:26:21  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: look at this: https://github.com/joyent/libuv/blob/5d92ccce9466dbfe8a613d0ee5ded1a959014554/src/win/udp.c#L190-L202
14:27:26  <txdv_>but this makes only if I use IPAddress.Any
14:27:46  <txdv_>that flag works only if I use IPAddress.Any, right?
14:28:11  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: well, I think so
14:28:28  <txdv_>ok, now I know how to design the ip for my wrapper
14:28:29  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: I think it would be IPV6Adrress.Any or something
14:29:03  <txdv_>C# has no IPV6Address.Any
14:29:04  <txdv_>xD
14:29:13  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: huh
14:29:15  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: IPAddress.IPv6Any
14:29:42  <txdv_>apparently it does
14:30:05  <piscisaureus_>sorry for not guessing the api right the first time :-/
14:30:30  <txdv_>don't worry, you are still awesome
14:31:43  <txdv_>I will have to test how to map this ipv4 address
14:31:52  <txdv_>these ipv4 addresses
14:32:19  <piscisaureus_>txdv_: well in dualstack sockets ipv4 addresses are mapped to a special range if ipv6 addresses
14:32:39  <txdv_>I can grab that special range and create appropriate ipv4 addresses
14:34:02  <txdv_>who implemented this feature? it is ncie, but i just wonder if that person did need it
14:34:12  <txdv_>lets use the blame button
14:34:33  <txdv_>piscisaureus and erickt
14:37:16  <txdv_>"::" is IP6Any
14:39:10  <indutny>I like ip6 addresses
14:39:30  <txdv_>nobody in europe has them
14:41:26  <indutny>same in russia
14:41:28  <indutny>almost the same
14:41:31  <indutny>some people have them
14:41:38  <txdv_>only the cool kids
14:41:46  <txdv_>who want to show of on irc with their cool hostname
14:44:55  <indutny>:)
14:45:10  <indutny>oh
14:45:14  <indutny>I think I'm on ipv6 right now
14:45:39  <indutny>2a02:6b8:0:40c:754c:31e7:b0ba:****
14:45:41  <indutny>haha
14:45:44  <indutny>ok, I'm the cool guy here
14:45:50  <indutny>though, I'm using irccloud
14:45:54  <indutny>so you won't see it
14:46:01  <indutny>ok
14:46:02  <indutny>gtg
14:46:03  <indutny>see ya
14:47:29  <txdv_>::ffff:192.168.0.108
14:47:33  <txdv_>this is how the mapping looks like
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14:50:44  <txdv_>now I wonder how to handle this mapping
14:50:59  <txdv_>overload methods to deal with it or should I just convert them internally in the class?
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15:06:35  <txdv_>works nicely
15:06:37  <txdv_>dualstack ftw
15:08:18  <txdv_>does tcp support dual stack too?
15:09:06  <piscisaureus_>yes but as I told you, on libuv we don't enable or disable it
15:09:19  <piscisaureus_>so it's off on windows and on on unix
15:09:30  <piscisaureus_>for udp all the platforms behave the same, it's on by default
15:10:24  <bnoordhuis>but broken on freebsd
15:11:50  <txdv_>dualstacks don't work on bsd?
15:13:04  <txdv_>I like this feature, it translates into some nice API
15:13:46  <txdv_>u.Bind(7000) // dualstack; u.Bind(IPAddress.IP6Any, 7000) // only ipv6
15:14:13  <bnoordhuis>txdv_: not sure, i didn't look into it much
15:14:35  <bnoordhuis>i did hear complaints from programmers on other projects but that may be unrelated
15:14:51  <txdv_>the additional flags field is ugly in C
15:15:01  <txdv_>but who programs in C anyway
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16:04:15  <MI6>joyent/libuv: Ben Noordhuis master * 4a69c4b : unix: change uv_backend_timeout() prototype * change return value to sig (+1 more commits) - http://git.io/lfEu3Q
16:04:48  <txdv_>116 issues
16:04:54  <txdv_>you guys should work through some of them
16:05:42  <bnoordhuis>txdv_: it's open source, we take patches :/
16:06:00  <txdv_>a shitload of them is obsolete
16:06:08  <bnoordhuis>that's the way it goes
16:06:24  <txdv_>i'm not talking about "writing patches" for them, but closing the obsolete
16:06:35  <bnoordhuis>if you post a comment along the lines of "obsolete because" i'll close them
16:07:01  <bnoordhuis>okay, off to pick up my daughter. biab
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16:16:04  <travis-ci>[travis-ci] Change view : https://github.com/joyent/libuv/compare/5d92ccce9466...4a69c4bb5f2b
16:16:04  <travis-ci>[travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/joyent/libuv/builds/3402779
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18:36:11  <isaacs>bnoordhuis, piscisaureus_: Would either of you be willing to write a brief blog post about the changes between 0.8 and 0.10 in libuv?
18:36:49  <isaacs>oh,looks like bertje is not around
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20:26:25  <bnoordhuis>isaacs: sure
20:26:43  <bnoordhuis>when should it be finished?
20:26:56  <bnoordhuis>(i'm a chronic procrastinator)
20:30:46  <CoverSlide>YESTERDAY!
20:33:40  <MI6>joyent/libuv: Ben Noordhuis master * df1399f : Remove *.mk and *.Makefile from .gitignore list The *.mk and *.Makefile - http://git.io/bpLksA
20:35:30  <indutny>nice
20:35:36  <indutny>bnoordhuis: time to pull in select() stuff?
20:35:48  <bnoordhuis>indutny: the os x stuff?
20:35:52  <indutny>bnoordhuis: yes
20:36:06  <indutny>isaacs: about crypto streaming, do you already have something working?
20:36:14  <bnoordhuis>hrm, maybe. i'd need to fire up my macbook first
20:36:21  <indutny>bnoordhuis: ok, cool
20:38:05  <indutny>bnoordhuis: thank you
20:38:29  <TooTallNate>was is reverted or something?
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20:46:45  <travis-ci>[travis-ci] joyent/libuv#898 (master - df1399f : Ben Noordhuis): The build passed.
20:46:45  <travis-ci>[travis-ci] Change view : https://github.com/joyent/libuv/compare/4a69c4bb5f2b...df1399fa758e
20:46:45  <travis-ci>[travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/joyent/libuv/builds/3406766
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20:53:12  <bnoordhuis>TooTallNate: yes, it was busy-looping
20:54:49  <MI6>joyent/node: Joshua Erickson v0.8 * c9f2531 : net: More accurate IP address validation and IPv6 dotted notation. * Add - http://git.io/5zW98g
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22:20:48  <txdv_>bnoordhuis: pisci is an animal of the day?
22:21:11  <bnoordhuis>txdv_: it varies
22:21:29  <bnoordhuis>i think he's mostly an animal of the four hour working day
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22:23:33  <txdv_>I already tried to implement write_start/stop on unix
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22:24:14  <txdv_>well stop works fine, but resuming threw me some errors at my head and I was too lazy to resolve them yet
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22:37:40  <isaacs>bnoordhuis: you should have already finished
22:37:51  <isaacs>indutny: it depends on streams2
22:37:56  <isaacs>indutny: it's in that branch
22:38:02  <indutny>isaacs: ah, yes
22:38:07  <indutny>isaacs: well, I would like to work on it
22:38:09  <indutny>a little
22:38:12  <indutny>not streams2
22:38:15  <indutny>crypto streams
22:38:19  <txdv_>streams2 will save the world
22:38:27  <indutny>or kill everyone
22:38:30  <indutny>they're too smart
22:38:34  <indutny>to trust them
22:38:39  <isaacs>indutny: yeah, i definitely don't trust them
22:38:43  <isaacs>all i've seen from them is bugs.
22:38:55  <isaacs>and work
22:39:22  <indutny>:)
22:39:27  <indutny>yes, that's how it works
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22:41:21  <txdv_>omg
22:41:25  <txdv_>he is going to kick us
22:41:46  <txdv_>the problem with stream2, even though it is well engineered and better to put up with streams
22:42:19  <txdv_>nobody is going to use it, because the streamsV1 is there and everyone is going to create their apis on top of that
22:43:58  <indutny>that's not true
22:44:14  <indutny>usage of every software depends on at least two factors
22:44:20  <indutny>1) It's quality
22:44:24  <indutny>well, three factors
22:44:31  <indutny>2) It's marketing
22:44:34  * txdv_changed nick to txdv
22:44:49  <indutny>3) And on how many friends/co-workers are using it
22:45:00  <indutny>spreading the word is the best way to make people trust it
22:45:01  <indutny>and use it
22:45:44  <txdv>I hope that is true
22:45:48  <deoxxa>streams2 is broken for various uses of streams
22:45:51  <deoxxa>:<
22:46:05  <isaacs>txdv: they'll keep using streams1, but streams1 will actually work how they think it works
22:46:20  <deoxxa>show me how to pipe a streams2 stream to more than one target and i'll be quiet
22:46:23  <isaacs>txdv: ie, paus() will actually pause(), you wont' lose data chunks by attaching listeners later
22:46:32  <isaacs>deoxxa: x.pipe(y); x.pipe(z)
22:46:38  <isaacs>deoxxa: that already works on streams2 branch
22:46:46  <deoxxa>isaacs: whaaaat, since when?
22:46:52  <isaacs>deoxxa: there's a test, even
22:46:52  <isaacs>yeah
22:46:59  <deoxxa>i couldn't see how that would work, with the pull-oriented api
22:47:00  * loladiroquit (Quit: loladiro)
22:47:01  <isaacs>99% backwards compatibility
22:47:21  <isaacs>deoxxa: it's easy, you just use javascript and write code to do that
22:47:30  * isaacsenjoys trivializing entire industries
22:47:34  <deoxxa>ha
22:47:41  <indutny>Ж)
22:47:45  <indutny>you know
22:47:56  <txdv>i'm just saying, even if you create a better API for streaming, not so many are going to use it, because it it isn't the 'official standard'
22:47:59  <indutny>I've recently thought about good advice to every developer
22:48:08  <indutny>"Think about what you want to do, and do it"
22:48:37  <isaacs>indutny: i agree, but not necessarily in that order
22:48:43  <piscisaureus_>txdv: I do not see the point of uv_write_stop at all
22:48:57  <piscisaureus_>txdv: if you don't want to write stuff, don't call uv_write. Or what else would be the purpose of it?
22:49:10  <piscisaureus_>isaacs: I won't join the meeting tomorrow as i will be in paris
22:49:33  <isaacs>k
22:49:37  <isaacs>piscisaureus_: bon voyage!
22:49:41  <isaacs>piscisaureus_: what's in paris?
22:49:47  <piscisaureus_>isaacs: dotjs.eu
22:49:55  <piscisaureus_>isaacs: merci beaucoup :-)
22:50:09  <isaacs>parlez vous francais?
22:50:19  <piscisaureus_>non
22:50:45  <isaacs>moi aussie
22:51:35  * hzquit
22:52:47  <isaacs>je l'ai étudié à l'école, mais maintenant je peux truquer seulement sur ​​Internet.
22:53:21  * warzquit
22:54:38  <piscisaureus_>oui
22:54:46  <piscisaureus_>pour moi, egalement
22:55:30  <piscisaureus_>sauf je ne cherche dan l'internet
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23:10:06  <indutny>isaacs: want to come to russia?
23:10:13  <isaacs>indutny: when?
23:10:18  <indutny>idk
23:10:21  <indutny>when are you free? :)
23:10:30  <indutny>I think we can organize something for you
23:10:37  <indutny>invite people and you may give a talk here
23:10:40  <indutny>if you want
23:10:51  <indutny>nodeconf.ru
23:11:02  <indutny>aha
23:11:08  <indutny>domain name is free
23:11:39  <indutny>I'll ask my friend at Yandex if there're some upcoming conferences in the start of next year
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