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09:11:52  <danneu>you're kinda way off
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15:24:38  <JFlash>hey I'm starting out with Koa
15:24:49  <JFlash>excited!
15:24:56  <JFlash>should I use Koa 1 or 2?
15:25:22  <JFlash>it's not a mission critical app
15:37:15  <danneu>JFlash: koa2 is basically koa1 but with build-step boilerplate
15:38:42  <danneu>i personally can't stand babel/webpack/etc. i like koa1 because there are fewer idiosyncracies
15:39:06  <danneu>while some people think babel is worth it. though know that koa2 isn't stable until await/async land in node natively
15:39:15  <JFlash>thank you danneu
15:42:31  <danneu>JFlash: i have a basic koa1 demo app that might be helpful https://koa-skeleton.danneu.com/ (it links to the github repo)
15:43:35  <JFlash>tks
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16:02:15  <JFlash>danneu, I'm leaning more towards Koa2 thou
16:02:31  <danneu>it's almost the same thing
16:02:31  <JFlash>danneu, the only reason I'd refrain from it if I find out very few ppl are using it
16:02:46  <JFlash>danneu, hence I would not be able to find help
16:02:56  <JFlash>easely
16:08:52  <JFlash>danneu, hey I stared your skeleton
16:09:04  <JFlash>now it only needs 11 stars to reach one hundred :D
16:11:05  <danneu>rofl
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16:20:58  <JFlash>danneu, what node frameworks did you try before Koa?
16:23:27  <danneu>i tried express for a little bit a couple years ago and didn't like. moved to koa pretty quickly since it's closer to what i'm used to.
16:27:47  <JFlash>and by used to you mean what?
16:28:16  <JFlash>danneu, are you on the gitter channel? I'm looking at the history there and interaction looks few and far between
16:28:39  <JFlash>is Koa still a "fringe framework" of sorts?
16:28:55  <JFlash>will I be missing out on community help by choosing Koa?
16:29:14  <danneu>if you're a real beginner, you should prob start with express
16:31:41  <danneu>there's a lot of express beginner material
16:32:05  <danneu>though as you get better with node, you'll get a higher-level undertanding of why express and koa aren't so different
16:33:25  <danneu>earlier i said i only used express for a lil bit before koa. but that's not so true. when i was a beginner, trying different technologies a number of years ago, i didn't even understand node.
16:33:54  <danneu>years after that when i was a much better developer is when i dove back into node
16:34:04  <danneu>but when i was a noob, it wasn't so easy.
16:40:45  <JFlash>well I done a lib with Node before and I also been into programming for 11 years now
16:41:27  <JFlash>so I dont mind the extra effort... but I'd miss not having a strong, supportive community
16:41:47  <JFlash>a lib = a little bit* of
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16:58:24  <danneu>#express is pretty dead too for being so much popular than koa
16:58:35  <danneu>even #node has the same 8 regulars
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16:59:02  <danneu>express def has a lot of tutorial-style resources though and stackoverflow answers
16:59:07  <danneu>just surprises me how little irc is used
16:59:43  <danneu>the main thing is that express and koa are very light wrappers around node itself
17:03:44  <danneu>the only thing novel about koa is the `yield` (koa1) or `await/async` (koa2) abstraction and those are new for everyone
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17:05:19  <danneu>what i like about it is that it lets you implement real middleware instead of express' neutered preware/afterware
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17:06:39  <danneu>anyways don't feel like you're making a big decision. express and koa are almost the same thing. other frameworks like restiful and hapi are far more different
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18:41:52  <jammi>I'm using koa2 without babel, works fine.
18:42:07  <jammi>promisified responders and that's it
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